The This Is Us Episode About What Life Would Be Like If Jack Had Lived Was So Emotional

What if Jack hadn’t died? That was the premise of the second-to-last episode of This Is Us before next week’s season four finale, in which Randall imagined how his life might have been different if his dad were still alive. Spoilers ahead.

It wasn’t the first time viewers have seen Jack (Milo Ventimiglia) in present-day form—that happened two years ago when Kate imagined having a dance with her father at her wedding to Toby—but it certainly was the most substantial. During Randall’s therapy session, he played out two different scenarios that involved Jack’s surviving the fire. The difference was that instead of an adult Randall finding out Rebecca visited William in his early years, he found out as a teenager.

In the first version, Randall was upset with his mom—but in typical fashion, he buried his anger and continued on his path as the straight-arrow son who always stepped up for his family. In the second version, Randall—still upset with Rebecca—became a more carefree spirit who didn’t marry Beth, dressed completely differently, and wasn’t the family man we know and love. (In that version, we also saw Kate married to someone other than Toby, and they have two girls.)

While it was both bittersweet and rewarding to see Jack in the present day, the emotional current of the episode was Randall’s evolving relationship with Rebecca and his need to always protect her. As we saw in last week’s episode, he even defied Kevin’s request to let Rebecca be happy for a few days in New York and instead brought up the possibility of enrolling her in an Alzheimers clinical trial in St. Louis. (She declined.)

But at the end of tonight’s episode, Randall revisited his suggestion and begged Rebecca to reconsider her decision. Hearing the pain in her son’s voice, she decided to go ahead with the plan, thereby setting up a showdown between Kevin and Randall that will no doubt fracture their relationship even further. To break it all down, we called up co-showrunners and executive producers Isaac Aptaker and Elizabeth Berger to get them to explain what’s to come and what it was like seeing Randall in this new light.

How long has the idea to have a “what if” episode been in the works?

Isaac Aptaker: It’s been in the works for a really long time. We’ve always known that we wanted to explore the notion of what their lives would be like if Jack had stuck around. But we were also incredibly aware of that being a little bit of a familiar trope. A lot of shows and movies do an alternate reality [storyline], how lives would have looked different. So once we stumbled upon the reason for it in our present-day storylines, where it would play into Randall’s therapy, we got really excited. It felt like it had a reason to exist and could be really propulsive in moving our actual stories forward.

It was so interesting to see Randall with an earring, with someone other than Beth. Then you have Kate with a different husband and two girls. How much did you discuss what this new Randall would look like?

Elizabeth Berger: I think we discussed it ad nauseam. I would say every single detail. Sterling had a lot of opinions. I think in both versions, even in the rose-colored version, we wanted to make sure there was a real logic to Randall’s thought process, that it isn’t just random but really thinking, “If I reconnected with William, then I would want to stay in town and I would meet Beth and it would all be able to go this way.” The same for the alternate version. We really wanted to really dig into what would make sense for that other sort of “worse” version of his life, down to the color of his suit, to the earring. These are all long, drawn-out conversations we had.

IA: But I think the worst version of his life, single Randall, is such a good dresser. He’s a much better dresser than real-life Randall. That all-green suit with the different tones, I think, is the coolest thing Sterling’s ever worn on the show. So maybe not everything was worse in his new life.

EB: That was very much based on Sterling’s [red carpet] fashion. We were looking at photos of him at different events and were like, “He looks really cool here! He should just have that in this alternative version.”

What were some of the suggestions Sterling wanted for this alternate Randall?

IA: He had a lot of thoughts about his look and how to make it different enough but not go overboard. He didn’t want it to feel like a cartoon where it wasn’t the same guy. He had strong opinions about the types of women [alternate Randall] would be dating, what his apartment would look like. It was really just making sure it all felt very different from the guy we know so it’s clear we’re in a different version of life, but also not a totally different person than we knew. That wouldn’t be realistic. So it was keeping it grounded but also distinct.

What was it like for Justin Hartley to play some of those scenes where Randall was more like Kevin and Kevin was more like Randall?

EB: It was cool, and I think they always enjoy playing against type. So to have these unexpected shifts, I think, is exciting for an actor. Sterling was totally game to push Randall into uncomfortable territory at the end of this episode. He’s not necessarily used to, as a character, making moves that are going to get audience members really upset and give them a lot of opinions about what he’s doing. But every actor here sort of faced these new twists and turns within their character head on, and we’re really excited to do it.

Talk about how the dynamic was different on set since Milo was able to be in a fair amount of present-day scenes with Sterling, Justin, and Chrissy. That had to be really neat for the cast.

EB: Everyone looks forward so much to working with actors they don’t usually get to work with in our cast. Milo, as you said, [rarely] gets to work with these incredible people. So I think it’s a joy whenever we can throw people together we never get to see together. It’s fun for them on set. And then when we get in the edit bay, we’re just like, “Ah, I wish we could see more of this all the time.” Everyone was thrilled by the opportunity to finally see these people on screen together.

I know you don’t want to exploit this concept, but is there any chance we would see a “what if” scenario or episode for Kate and Kevin down the line?

EB: It is totally possible. As I said, it’s finding the right entry point and reason to do it, but it’s something we really loved doing. It’s something we think is sort of inherent to the fabric of the show, to explore these other realities, because so much of their lives pivoted based on their father’s death. It’s definitely something we’re interested in exploring down the line.

IA: Or we could just do a whole spin-off hour called Jack’s Fine that’s just about the family [and] Jack’s alive.

I love it! Also, we’ve seen Rebecca struggle with Kate, but we’ve never seen Rebecca and Randall struggle to this extent. Mandy Moore, Sterling K. Brown, and Niles Fitch were all heartbreakingly brilliant in those scenes. Why did you want to explore that relationship further?

EB: Randall and Rebecca obviously have this incredibly close dynamic, but so much, as we know, has been put on Randall’s shoulders from a very young age, especially after his father’s death. He really was the one that stayed home and helped get his mother through it. And you’re right, we never see this explored. We felt like therapy is a place where everything you internalize comes out and explodes. We felt like if ever there was a time for this to happen, this would be it. We were interested in getting into everything that Randall’s been pressing over so many decades finally coming out and bubbling to the surface.

At the end of the episode, Randall convinces Rebecca to do the clinical trial in St. Louis. Before we get to what that means for story purposes, is this an actual trial in St. Louis at Washington University?

IA: We’ve been talking to doctors who run these trials, so this is our fictionalized version of a number of real trials we’re combining into one. We’ve talked extensively to Alzheimers specialists about what these trials look like, what they require of patients. They really do require relocating and being at a center where you can be monitored and given these infusions regularly. So everything Randall’s saying, we’re vetting with experts in the field.

Washington University in St. Louis is one of the most respected universities in the country. How did you decide on it?

IA: We asked where the few most common geographical locations would be for [this kind of trial]. And that was the one that came up.

Sterling K. Brown is from St. Louis. Is there any chance you will be going on location to film at Wash U. in season five?

IA: We have talked about it, and we’ve talked about it with Sterling. It’s still a little bit early as we’re just mapping out the nitty-gritty of our season five. But it is definitely something that’s been bandied about.

Obviously there’s hope Rebecca’s condition might be helped by this clinical trial, but we know that things don’t seem to be going so well when they’re at the cabin celebrating the Big Three’s 40th birthday five months from now. Randall and Kevin aren’t speaking, and Rebecca has just been brought home by local authorities after getting lost. How much will we learn about those roadblocks in next week’s finale?

EB: In next week’s finale, not so much. It’s more stuff we’re going to be exploring when we return. Yes, it’s true, we’ve seen a glimpse of Rebecca down the line a few months from now, but we haven’t seen the whole context of that episode that she’s having. So it’s something we’re going to be revisiting. People are going to get more answers about what exactly is happening there and why that happened to her at that time.

As for Kevin, will we find out who his fiancé is in the finale next week?

IA: We will not necessarily find out who his fiancé is next week, but we’ll get some big steps forward.

Will there be a time jump in the finale?

IA: The finale jumps all over the place. You’re going to have to really sit there with notes and try to keep up and guess where you are in time.

What else can you say about next week’s season four finale?

IA: I think people will have a lot of the answers they’ve been wondering about [regarding] what’s going on between the brothers. It really queues us up for our return, which is going to be that 40th birthday episode. And of course, as our finales always do, we’ll throw in a few curve balls that people could never see coming unless they’ve been hiding under our writers room conference table.

Will we get more answers on what is going on with Kate and Toby and their relationship?

IA: Yeah, we have a great [story for them] next week. It's a really special one that gets to a really unexpected place.

EB: Yeah, it’s a really beautiful episode that is written by [creator] Dan Fogelman himself, and he did an unbelievable job with the script. The actors are unbelievable in what they’ve done with it, and we can’t wait for everyone to see it. It’s a very exciting episode of TV.

The This Is Us season four finale airs Tuesday, March 24, on NBC. Jessica Radloff is the West Coast editor at Glamour. You can follow her on Instagram at @jessicaradloff14.

Originally Appeared on Glamour