Breaking Bad Star Jesse Plemons Doesn't Need You to Like Him

Jesse Plemons wants to talk, sure, but first he wants to order some food. He hasn't eaten all day, the 31-year-old actor tells me restlessly, and—interview or no interview—it's time for lunch. Work can wait.

We're sitting in the celebrity hotspot Nobu in midtown Manhattan, a place quite hilariously incongruous with the kind of character and style people associate with Plemons. Since coming to prominence in the revered network drama Friday Night Lights as Landry, a Texas high schooler with a heart of gold, he's carved out a respectable reputation as an icon in the "soft-spoken weirdo" character actor category.

Outside of Friday Night Lights, most will know Plemons as Todd, Jesse Pinkman's jailer and torturer in later seasons of Breaking Bad. The character returned as a surprise in El Camino last month, a Netflix film that follows Pinkman's immediate response to his trauma after escaping Todd, while flashing back to their time together that shines more light on the (possibly) sociopathic character.

Then there's the likes of the acclaimed "USS Callister" episode of Black Mirror, his Internet-favorite turn in 2018's surprise hit Game Night, and Season 2 of Fargo, during which he met his costar-turned-fiancée, Kirsten Dunst. Plemons's resume is impressive, despite the fact he's been working pretty much nonstop since his teen years.

As is the case with much of the characters who make up his body of work, Plemons is charming and speaks slowly and deliberately in real life, but there's an obvious undercurrent of something more working behind his eyes. It's what makes him, hero, villain, or anything in between, such an effective actor. GQ spoke with the man himself about revisiting Todd, fatherhood, and his upcoming turn in Charlie Kaufman's mind-bending new movie, I'm Thinking Of Ending Things.

GQ: So how long were you not allowed to talk about El Camino?

Jesse Plemons: My timeline is all messed, but I think it was almost a year. Yeah, a year.

I wasn't keeping close tabs but it seems like you guys did a good job of not being noticed, despite the fact you were back in Albuquerque shooting on location.

We were in the desert quite a lot, but there was one day where the scene was me driving Jesse to his apartment. It's in downtown Albuquerque and we were there all day; shooting, driving around in a hot car. Wardrobe, makeup, all of it. There were people all around, and this one guy noticed and took some pictures. I thought surely that was it, but somehow the secret stuck.

Maybe there's some kind of weird, underground Albuquerque cult that keeps everybody quiet about Breaking Bad now.

Well, I think Melissa [Bernstein], the producer, is the head of that cause. She really instills fear in you about not spoiling it.

Before Breaking Bad, Landry was probably how most people knew you. Todd is a much darker character, but with elements of that charm. What's your understanding of Todd—clinically, even?

I'm conflicted. He's so tough to break down. I like the fact people have their own theories. All I had in the beginning to work with was a small breakdown: That he's fresh-faced and eager to please... He seems harmless but there's something deep inside there.

So then, I got the part and no one would really tell me anything, since I was a recurring character and not a regular. You don't really learn much about him the first few episodes. The only directions I really got in those early days from Vince [Gilligan] was moments before I shoot that kid on the bike at the end of the train episode. He came up to me and said "OK, so if you're driving and a raccoon runs out in front of you, you have two choices: You can swerve to the right and drive into a ditch, or you can swerve left into oncoming traffic: What do you do?" And I stood there for a second, thinking there was more to it, but that was it. That's what I got.

Once Uncle Jack comes into the picture, I started thinking about it a bit more. I think Todd's mother was not the best. I think Todd is just missing some... crucial... crucial part of his human makeup that allows him to grasp his actions, really, He does show empathy at certain times, but if he can rationalize something terrible, there's not a second thought.

Do you not think there's a part of him that enjoys how his perceived mildness puts people on the back foot compared to his brutality?

When I was shooting I went back and forth about how aware Todd actually is about how he comes off. Maybe at times? But overall, because of what I had at the beginning, there's an innocence there. I think perhaps he's on the spectrum, and he just doesn't read cues all that well, including his own.

I don't know how much we're allowed to talk about this, but you're also in Charlie Kaufman's new movie, I'm Thinking Of Ending Things for Netflix. I read that book and... damn. It really scared me in a visceral way.

[Laughs.] Just wait. He Kaufman-ized it.

What did you think when you read it?

I thought I'd honestly never read anything like it. I read the script first. I was sitting at home, contemplating playing a robot in this other thing, and this just fell from the sky. I've been a huge fan of [Kaufman's] forever. I had a weekend with my friend where we started at the beginning and went through all his films and dissected them as much as you can. Synecdoche, New York... it's brutal.

This seems like a very difficult book to adapt, so I'm glad to hear it's maybe going to be even weirder.

I would say Charlie took maybe 15 percent of the dialogue. I don't know how this keeps happening... Not only working with people you respect but then them also turning out to be great human beings.

Have you seen Wild Rose with [co-star] Jessie Buckley? I'm gonna watch it on the plane ride home. She's unbelievable. Toni Collette and David Thewlis play my parents: The weirdest and best married couple of all time.

Home for you is L.A., I'm guessing.

I still have one foot in Austin. I'd like to spend more time there, but it's where we shot Friday Night Lights. I love that city, my family's there. For some reason, they won't pass the tax incentives in Texas. There are some great directors who live there: Linklater and Jeff Nichols and Robert Rodriguez. David Lowery, too. I love Texas. We're gonna leave it partially up to our son. He's going to have some say in where he goes to school. He's one-and-a-half now, so there's time.

How's fatherhood?

It's the best, man. It's so hard to put into words. All the cliches are true, what every parent tells you.

I guess as an actor you're already used to being tired all the time, so that's good for a baby.

I swear! That's one of the saving graces of getting used to working odd hours, working all night. People complain about not getting enough sleep, but there's not better reason on earth to lose sleep, you know? And if you're lucky enough to have family around and to be able to get some help you trust. It is hard, being away, but it's also just so much fun to watch the lights turn on, slowly, more and more every day.

Black Mirror, I'm Thinking Of Ending Things, or Fargo: Which was weirdest?

I'm Thinking Of Ending Things, for sure. I don't think it's spoiling much to say that in the first week, we were shooting pretty much in a car every day. Thank God we shot that on a stage. I was pretty intimidated because we were shooting on average 11 pages a day, every day, on a stage, prop guys throwing snow. It was almost... "psychological torture" is too strong, but it did have a strange effect. Jessie and I became delirious and were laughing a lot. The longest take is something like 16 minutes I think? So it was like "Action! See ya in a while!" It changed acting for me in a way, I think.

Fargo in 2015 was my favorite season of the show. I feel like Landry and Todd at least have this kind of bright-eyed promise to them, in very different ways. What was it like changing course to Ed, this beaten-down family man?

I feel like Ed has maybe the biggest heart, even though he ground a guy's body down in a meat grinder. [Laughs.] I guess I was drawn to that unflagging love and devotion to his wife, which is his own demise right?

And I'm sure that role and that shoot has a special place in your heart because she actually became your (soon-to-be) wife.

Right! Man. The absolute last thing I... ever expected to happen. We became great friends while we were filming. Most of our scenes were together. We just immediately hit it off work-wise. We'd throw out ideas and it was an amazing working relationship.

And it was like, she was always there. Noah [Hawley, Fargo show runner] was there part of the time and there was a new director every two episodes. So that trust with Kirsten... and Daryl, one of the camera operators. I was with them every day.

You were going to marry one of them, is what you're saying.

I thought it was gonna be Daryl! And then, you know, a year and a half later... I wasn't dating anyone, she wasn't dating anyone and [long pause] something changed. [Laughs.]

But you know, there was some concern in my mind about it being circumstantial at first. We were isolated in Calgary. It's good to know it wasn't.

To switch gears, I would like to say I think you deserve an Oscar for Game Night.

You know what? I take it back, I think Gary has the biggest heart. He just so desperately wants to be wanted, and he can't help but come off as a creep. His insides don't match his outside, you know? I think an early draft of the script described him as being "Michael Shannon-esque" and that definitely informed some of my choices. What a fun movie.

For some reason lately it's hard for theatrical comedies to break through, but Game Night was the exception.

Honestly, I thought it could go either way, but Game Night was the best possible version of what it could have been. And yeah, Sebastian, I really hit it off with that dog. Olivia was actually her name. He was a she.

Oh right! I remember reading that was the same dog from Widows.

Yes! That's right! Very sought after dog. In-demand. The take where she licks my face... I would make it a point to hold her as much as possible in between scenes to develop our relationship, and she just gave me a little lick at the perfect moment.

And then, we've got to talk about "USS Callister." Robert Daly. Maybe your most despicable character?

You know, thinking about it now I would say the one through-line with the characters I choose is that they are maybe people who aren't... immediately accessible. Because most people aren't in real life.

What's interesting about Daly is we shot almost all the spaceship scenes first, the Captain Daly scenes. Then I shaved my head, carved into my hairline, and suddenly I'm walking into the office in this different world. It was pretty affecting as an actor. My perspective of the character changed, even though it was all in the script already and I knew where it was going.

I'm still not sure how I feel about him. In some ways, is it not the same thing as fiction? The people in his simulation, they're not real.

But they believe they're real, which is kind of the horror right?

That’s true. But someone on set told me that they were bullied a lot in middle school and in high school, and that it made sense to see [how Daly treats the people in his simulation]. I think apart from Cristin Milioti’s character, none of them are particularly good people.

Kind of the same with a lot of your roles.

That's what I'm going for.

This interview has been edited and condensed.

Coming soon to a streaming service near you.

Originally Appeared on GQ