RuPaul Breaks Down His Latest Talk Show, "RuPaul"
Multiple Emmy Award-winning TV host, producer, writer, musician and performer RuPaul brings his distinctive voice, exceptional interview skills, passion for helping others and inclusive brand of humor to broadcast television in a daily talk show, "RuPaul." In it, he showcases his aspirational message with celebrity and newsmaker interviews, along with empowering everyday people to become their best selves.
Video Transcript
[MUSIC PLAYING]
RICKY CAMILLERI: Thanks, everybody. Welcome to BUILD. I'm your host, Ricky Camilleri. Our next guest is, in fact, a legend, an incredible legend. After trailblazing the path in the '90s as easily the most well-known, if not, only household name drag queen alive, RuPaul went on to create and host the wildly successful "Drag Race" on VH1.
But now he's turning his attention towards a dream he's always had, daytime TV. On RuPaul's new "RuPaul" he talks to fans, celebrities, and tells stories from his heart. The show starts Monday for three weeks on Fox stations across the country. Let's take a look.
- I love having parties, and bringing people over, and just creating an atmosphere where people can just relax and be themselves. And I could get to know them. Now, here's my favorite room for parties right here. That's-- lots of col-- it looks just like this in here actually. There is every color in the rainbow there. And I want people to feel comfortable, because I have modern, mixed with, you know, Louis XIV craziness.
- But what I love with what you have here is-- I mean, you are definitely our property brother from another mother, because you're showing people, one, color is back, and colors have been around for a long time, but people have been afraid to show it. And, also, you can mix and match. Not everything has to be the same--
- Yeah.
- To have contrast, it's actually more beautiful in a design.
- It is. And I think that's what makes life interesting, it's contrast.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Everyone, please welcome the absolutely incredible, the legend, the great RuPaul. Let's hear it.
RUPAUL: Yeah. Thank you.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Give it up. Give it up.
RUPAUL: Thank you so much. I love it.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Thank you so much for being here. It's amazing to sit down and talk to you.
RUPAUL: Well, thank you, Ricky Ticky Toc.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Oh, that is a new one. That is very much a new one. I usually get the Steely Dan song, or I get Ricky Don't Lose-- or, hey, Ricky, you're so fine. I've never gotten Ricky Ticky--
RUPAUL: Or, talk to the hand, Ricki.
RICKY CAMILLERI: I've never gotten that one either.
RUPAUL: Remember that one? Just what are you doing with your life?
RICKY CAMILLERI: You said talk to the hand, Ricki. I always thought it was just talk to the hand.
RUPAUL: Yo guys remember that from the Ricki Lake show? Anybody? Talk to the hand, Ricki. That was the thing. Listen, it is a pleasure to be in this room. You know how many hours I've spent in this room when it was Tower Records? This was such a hang out for me. I have been-- I bought so many records and CDs in this building. For those of you watching around the world, this building, where we are being filmed right now, used to be the location of Tower Records here in New York City at 4th and Broadway. And I am overjoyed to be in this room again.
RICKY CAMILLERI: When did you-- how--
[APPLAUSE]
RUPAUL: Thank you. Thank you. I'll be here all week. Thank you.
RICKY CAMILLERI: When did-- when did you move to New York?
RUPAUL: The first time I moved to New York was in 1984. And I was sleeping on couches, and on the piers, and in Central Park. And after about six months, the city spit me right back out. And I moved back to Atlanta. And then I came back up here in '87.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Were you-- I actually happened to just watch this-- were you living in New York at the time that you got cast in the "Love Shack" video? Because they're from Atlanta-- or from Georgia.
RUPAUL: Yeah. Well, yes, we knew them. My crowd knew them from Atlanta. In fact, when I was started in bands in Atlanta.
RICKY CAMILLERI: You were in punk bands, right?
RUPAUL: Yes. Everybody in that area had flocked from all over the southeast to come to Atlanta, because The B-52's and REM had hit it big. So everybody in that area was thinking, well, we'll go to Atlanta, and we'll start a band, and we'll do that. So that's what everybody was doing. And we knew them from the Atlanta scene.
And then they asked me to be in the "Love Shack" video, which was 30 years ago, by the way. And I had just come from up in the club, so I was wearing the same thing I'd been up in the club in, I'm wearing it up in the video. And it's me with this big Afro on, if you've seen the "Love Shack" video. 30 years ago [INAUDIBLE]. 30 years ago.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Like, high silver shorts, right?
RUPAUL: No, they were--
RICKY CAMILLERI: Excuse me.
RUPAUL: They were these white hot pants--
RICKY CAMILLERI: Yes, that's what it was.
RUPAUL: Yeah, with this-- I had this t-shirt that I'd cut up, and strapped, and turned it to a halter top, or something, you know. It was-- it was--
RICKY CAMILLERI: It's amazing to go back and look at that, as well as look at the fact that you were in punk bands. I mean, to put it in a certain way, you have been grinding creatively for so long. What does it feel like to be at this point this many years down the road, to have your own talk show? This is something that you've kind of always wanted, right?
RUPAUL: Yes, I've always wanted it. And it feels the exact same. The thing is, you know, I started in show biz professionally in '82. And then "Supermodel" came out in '92. So those 10,000 hours, if you will, those were my college years. Those were the years when I put in the hard yards. But I was doing-- I was doing all of the same things I'm doing today, I was doing back then.
RICKY CAMILLERI: I just watched a clip of you on "Geraldo" in 1990 where you essentially say you want a show like Geraldo's those shows in that moment.
RUPAUL: Yeah. You speak it into existence. You guys watching out there, you are more powerful than you think. Now, of course, in the spirit world, there is no such thing as time and space. So when that stuff was going to happen, you don't know, but you speak it into existence, because we are all extensions of the power that created the whole universe. So you're very powerful. And what most people are doing is they're playing small, they're playing a small version of themselves for whatever reason, whatever floats your boat. You can do that if you want. But if you want a show, you better tell somebody, talk to the hand, Ricki.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Have you ever--
[APPLAUSE]
RUPAUL: You know what I mean?
RICKY CAMILLERI: In the course, in the many years of that you've had this career, because you've had many years, in the course of this career that you had, have you ever found yourself wanting to play small, or feeling like you had to go back to playing small, because it got daunting, or there's ups and downs, or you didn't know how to make it through a certain point?
RUPAUL: No, I think I was smart enough to know that playing small wasn't going to happen. If there was a place where I had to play small, I needed to find another place, you know, to be. But no, no. You know, I felt that way when I was in San Diego. I grew up-- I'm born and raised in San Diego. And I left San Diego to move to Atlanta with my sister when I was 15. And so when I left--
RICKY CAMILLERI: Just you and your sister?
RUPAUL: It was my sister and her husband. They were-- Atlanta was in the middle of this huge boom. Atlanta is-- the symbol of the city is the Phoenix. And Atlanta has had so many booms. It's something energetically about that region of the country, it just keeps rebirthing itself.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Well, just in the last few years it's had a humongous hip hop boom.
RUPAUL: Oh, yeah.
RICKY CAMILLERI: The music scene is incredible there right now.
RUPAUL: Well, actually, that's been going on for a while with--
RICKY CAMILLERI: I mean, it's broken through to the mainstream.
RUPAUL: Outcast, and those kids-- you know, those young whippersnappers. It's been doing-- It's been doing that forever. And in '74, when Maynard Young became mayor of-- the first black mayor of Atlanta-- there was this other huge resurgence of culture there, so we moved there then. So I went to high school at the north side School of Performing Arts. And that's where I started my career in Atlanta.
RICKY CAMILLERI: When did drag become a part of your life?
RUPAUL: You know, when I was-- my mother was pregnant with me, she saw a psychic who said, you're going to have a boy, and he is going to be famous. And so I grew up with this idea of wanting to-- wanting to be famous, and knowing I would be famous. I didn't know how I would do it. I thought, you know, I loved David Bowie, I thought I would be the next David Bowie. I thought, well, that's how I'll do it. Well, I started out in that direction.
And then the universe-- it's very important for you to be open and clear enough to hear the universe's stage direction. You have to have your ears open, and your heart open to hear the universe's stage direction. Repeat that in your head. And what you do, so I wanted to be David Bowie, but the universe said, bitch, you are a drag queen.
[LAUGHTER]
I said, what? And so, because, you know, in the band I was in--
RICKY CAMILLERI: What was the name of the band?
RUPAUL: Well, my band was called Wee Wee Pole. Wee Wee Pole. And when I dressed up in drag the first time, I was guesting, I was in a group called RuPaul and the U-Hauls, and we were guesting in a group called Now Explosion. They were called Now Explosion. They were very much like the B-52's.
Anyway, while I was a guest in their band, they all dressed up in drag. And we were doing what we refer to as gender F word style of drag. Gender F word style of drag. I'll repeat the things that you need to hear, so don't worry. And, you know, it was combat boots, and smeared lipstick, and ahh, and ripped up dresses and stuff.
RICKY CAMILLERI: The sort of punk version of Androgyny at that time.
RUPAUL: Exactly. And the reaction I got from people was not one I expected. People were like, wow, you look good. You look-- those legs. And that was before I was shaving my legs, or shaving my chest, or anything, but I knew something was up. And again, the stage directions from the universe were like, huh, there's something here.
And then as time went on, and bills needed to be paid, I shaved them legs, and went to lady Foot Locker, put some socks up in a bra, and history was made, baby. And I moved-- I moved to New York with a pair of high heels and a dream. Hello.
RICKY CAMILLERI: And then--
[APPLAUSE]
RUPAUL: That's it.
RICKY CAMILLERI: You know, watching this clip of you in 1990 on "Geraldo," you're with all of the club kids. But, really, I think, in that show, in that episode, you're the only-- you're the only, really, the drag-- only drag queen on stage. Everybody's made up. But what was it like in the '90s? I mean, you were the most famous, probably, drag queen in the world. And you were also ushering in a, sort of-- I think you were ushering in one of the few LGBTQ pioneers that was going into the mainstream. You were on VH1 1. You were in people's homes. My parents knew who you were. And they were conservative, like, white people who did not pay attention to any subculture whatsoever.
RUPAUL: What town were they in?
RICKY CAMILLERI: Massa-- they were in Massachusetts in Holyoke.
RUPAUL: Holyoke, Massachusetts.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Holyoke in East Hampton. Yeah.
RUPAUL: I can't say Massachushits.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Really?
RUPAUL: No. I've never been able to say it. Massachusetts.
RICKY CAMILLERI: But were you-- were-- were you aware of the effect that you were having? Were you intentionally doing that, or were you just grinding, and getting jobs, and hustling, and working?
RUPAUL: Both, both. I was aware of how fortunate I was and am today, which is a big part of hearing the universe's stage direction. You also have to be present enough to know that you are fortunate and that you are breathing clean air, drinking clean water. You have running water in your house. All of those things. That's a part of the package.
But, also, I've always been ambitious. I've always loved creativity. I love it. I drink it in. I want to touch all the colors in the rainbow. And I want to sing and dance, and laugh. And I want to laugh, laugh some more. Yeah, that's what I like. So, yes, I was ambitious, and grinding away, and making it happen, but also very conscious of what came before me, and what I wanted to do, you know?
But then there came a time in '99 where I thought, you know what, I'm going to step back for a minute. You know, an artist steps away from the canvas. And, again, I intuitively, instinctively knew it was time to step away. And I, you know, got a house in California, and had barbecues, and got to know my nieces and nephews. And a big part of the story is I quit drinking and doing drugs. And so, but for about four years, I worked, but I wasn't ambitious the way I had been. I didn't watch my weight, which was a dream.
RICKY CAMILLERI: It's the best.
RUPAUL: Oh, my goodness. It was great. And we would have-- I would have--
RICKY CAMILLERI: I think that day where you go, oh, I feel like shit.
RUPAUL: Yeah, exactly. But I would have barbecues. And I would have these big boxes of old wigs, and old shoes, and everybody who would come over would do a number in the backyard. And I had a stripper pole back there, and a pool. Once, Bea Arthur came over with a friend. And she-- I had this tall driveway. And she took her shoes off to walk up the driveway, and knocked on the door, and she was carrying her shoes when I answered the door. But I'll never forget her watching one of my friends in some ratty old wig lip syncing "Hit Me, Baby, One More Time" by Britney Spears. It was good times, good times.
RICKY CAMILLERI: But I think-- I mean, if you look at the chronology of your career, you know, in the '90s you go on something like "Geraldo," you create the "RuPaul Show" on VH1. There is a part of that that at that time is wildly subversive and confrontational.
RUPAUL: Oh, yeah.
RICKY CAMILLERI: And there's a much smaller audience at that time that is open to what you're presenting to the world, whereas "Drag Race," families across the country gather to watch "Drag Race." And you have sort of been one of the pioneers of that. Were you aware in the '90s that part of what you were doing was sort of allowing a certain amount of exploitation to shock lots of people but still being a kind of back way into mainstreaming a lot of who you were in your community?
RUPAUL: I'm just going to stop him here and back up to-- he just said, you were sort of one of the pioneers to this movement. Did you hear that?
[LAUGHTER]
Actually, I didn't hear anything he said after that.
[LAUGHTER]
RICKY CAMILLERI: I don't want to-- Ru-- Ru, if I say the pioneer, there's going to be another pioneer who's going to be like, hey!
RUPAUL: Yeah, yeah, bring they ass up here. I want to see them. Yeah. If they exist, I want to meet them.
[LAUGHTER]
RICKY CAMILLERI: And I called you a legend. I said the great-- I'm not sure you--
RUPAUL: Yeah, exactly. No.
RICKY CAMILLERI: So you were the pioneer at this-- like, of this time, and through this moment.
RUPAUL: And, listen, there were people before me. I mean, David Bowie-- people my age-- David Bowie is the beginning and end of all of that stuff. He represents this idea of seeing yourself as a construct. And the idea of drag is seeing yourself as a construct, of putting on an outfit.
You know, people my age, we grew up reading "Interview Magazine" and hearing about the Warhol superstars where you would move to New York, dye your hair, change your name, and overnight you were a superstar. So we all followed that template. And David Bowie is a part of that. So I follow that same template. And the whole drag creed, the motto of drag is that.
Now, I think you were going into this concept of drag being mainstream. And there is an aspect, a superficial aspect of drag that is mainstream where people are saying, oh, she threw me shade, and, oh, work it, girl, oh, she is giving me lots of gags. I don't know if people say that, but-- it seems like something people might say, you know, in the mainstream. I wouldn't know. But-- you know, she's giving me lots of gag. Anyway, so-- OK-- so, yes.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Found a new one.
RUPAUL: Yes, yes, I got it. It's on a t-shirt. So, right. So the superficial part, people, yeah, yeah, I got it. But the deeper meaning of drag is lost on most people, because the deeper meaning of drag would require that people, masses of people, see themselves as a construct, understand that you are not really what it says you are on your driver's license, you are an extension of the power that created the whole universe, and that you-- you are everything and nothing at all.
Say it with me, you are everything and nothing at all. Now, that concept is what drag is about. And that's why drag will never be mainstream, because to grasp it on that deeper level, you'd have to understand that. And that level requires you to deconstruct your whole belief system and then rebuild it again, just like Atlanta. Atlanta burned to the ground, honey. It burned to the groun-- it was burnt, OK? And it--
RICKY CAMILLERI: Did it catch fire? I'm sorry-- oh, OK, yeah.
RUPAUL: But it kept rebuilding itself. And I feel so proud to have come from Atlanta, because it represents the process of crucifixion and resurrection, which is what we are all doing. And if you're not doing that, you've got to be rethinking your life, hun. If you are not pissing people off in this life, you really need to rethink what your life plan is. Truly. Get a round of applause for that one? It's true. Yeah.
RICKY CAMILLERI: So going into "RuPaul," and going into daytime talk, what is it about, you know, all of your career that we've sort of briefly covered just now, and your pioneering, being the pioneer over the course of that time.
[LAUGHTER]
RUPAUL: He's catching on. He's catching on.
RICKY CAMILLERI: That you are bringing into daytime talk. What did you want to do to sort of revolutionize and change daytime talk?
RUPAUL: We are at such an interesting crossroads in our culture, in this country, around the world. It's almost like in the TV show "Downton Abbey" where they're going from the 19th century into the 20th century. And all these changes, and people are trying to find their way, we're in that right now. And I think that's why that show resonated so beautifully at this time. What this time is like is like the metamorphosis of a butterfly. You know, from the cocoon to the butterfly, in between there, it's painful, it's dramatic, it is--
RICKY CAMILLERI: It's so optimistic. I see it more as Kafka's man turns to bug, and doesn't know what to do with himself.
RUPAUL: And then there's that, too. But, you know-- so we're in the middle. And I want to be a part of the conversation that helps people, myself-- when I say people I'm really talking about myself-- navigate this really strange tricky area of the human existence that we're in right now. And I know that we've helped that with our show "Drag Race" with showing these courageous, beautiful, sweet, sensitive souls who have found a place in this murky existence to shine and to be beautiful.
And I know that around the world-- you know, our show streams around the world on all these devices, these kids with their, you know-- and the stories that these queens tell of families pushing them away, or deserting them, but them finding a family, a tribe out there-- that is so optimistic. And those are the navigational tools that have helped so many people. And I want to be a navigational tool for the daytime audience, for a broader audience. And it's quite an honor to be given this opportunity.
RICKY CAMILLERI: It's a different audience now than it was when we look back on your moment on "Geraldo," or what the daytime talk show environment was then. It was all about shock. It was always about the news of the moment, in a lot of ways. And Oprah kind of changed that a lot by being much more optimistic-- not kind of changed it, she did change it. She was the pioneer.
RUPAUL: You're a tough customer. You are tough.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Yeah, yeah, Oprah, RuPaul, whatever-- no.
[LAUGHTER]
You seem to, sort of, be taking a bit of-- a kind of a cue from her in a way, in the sense that your show is so positive, and is so life affirming, and it's not just about bringing celebrities on and hearing their stories. It's about showcasing different aspects of yourself. I think largely it feels about showcasing a very different aspect of who you are.
RUPAUL: Well, you know, it's interesting you say that, because as you were saying it, I was thinking, you know, every time I hear someone's story, the questions I ask are really for myself. You know, I love the book "Animal Farm" because it's about the human experience and how humans forget, they forget-- the animals in there, they forgot why they had a revolution in the first place, is basically the crux of the story. So you don't have to read it. I've told you what happens. And--
[LAUGHTER]
But I-- it's like every morning I wake up, it's like Groundhog's Day, I forget all over again. So I'm looking-- so I will get down on that floor, and when I wake up, I stretch, then I pray, and then I meditate, just to create a balance, so that I can remember what I came here to do. So, you know, when I ask a person a question, I'm really asking because I need to remember who I really am. And, thankfully, hopefully, people watching will get something out of it, too.
People said to me this morning, they said, RuPaul, you know, did you know that you were going to be a role model? And I said, no, I didn't set out to be a role model, I set out to be a supermodel. Can I get an amen up in here? Thank you. Thank you. I'll be here all week. Thank you.
RICKY CAMILLERI: But did you ever-- did you ever recognize that you were a role model? And when did you recognize that you may have been a role model?
RUPAUL: Yeah, no, I recognized it, but that's not what I wake up to do every morning. I'm waking up to live my life. And if you could get something out of my experience, I say, right on, buddy. Right on. But that's not-- that's-- I'm not trying to be, you know, no messiah, or anything like that. So with the talk show, the whole concept is I'm interested in people who, after living on this planet for as long as they have, wake up in the morning and decide, yes, I'm going to put some clothes on, and I'm going to go out there, and I'm going to knock them dead, I'm going to-- I'm going to give it to them. I'm interested in that. Because, you know, if you are a sweet sensitive soul, like we all are, everyone in this room, and people watching around the world, life is really hard. It's hard-- it seems harder now.
And it seems like other people walking around at 4th and Broadway, they all look like they have a purpose, and they have the instruction book. Did you all get the instruction book, because I didn't get one? And even as a kid, I remember looking at people, and thinking, they must have it. I want to ask them. I wanted to break the fourth wall, like in a Woody Allen film, and go, hey, did you get the instructions? I thought he'd get one, you know? And I wanted to ask him.
That's what our show-- our talk show is about. Now, drag on its own is really about underlining and spotlighting the hypocrisy, the hoax, that all this illusion is, right? This illusion that we're in. Drag is like saying, look, now I'm this, look, now I'm that. I'm talking all drag, whether you're dressed in a three piece suit, or you work at McDonald's, or you work, whatever, doing whatever, I don't know what other jobs there are.
RICKY CAMILLERI: There's only a three piece suit and McDonald's. That's all that there is.
[LAUGHTER]
That's it. That's it. You boiled it down.
RUPAUL: So, you know, everybody's--
RICKY CAMILLERI: Wait, wait, wait, are we three piece suit, or are we McDonald's?
RUPAUL: I think we're three piece.
RICKY CAMILLERI: OK, OK. Sometimes I feel like McDonald's, though, I will say that.
RUPAUL: But, you know, we're all in drag. We're all in drag. And the point of drag is to point that out. You know-- you know, I have this theory that, you know, sweet, sensitive souls, there are these different levels of recognition, right? Kind of like Dorothy in "The Wizard of Oz" when she looks behind the curtain, and goes, wait a minute, you're the Wiz? And we have that same experience when we, sweet, sensitive souls, when we realize that we've been hoaxed by this illusion, by this whole illusion.
And the different levels of recognition are, first of all, you're angry, you're angry. The second level of that recognition is you've become cynical. And the next level of that is that it can turn into just straight up bitterness, because you think I've been hoaxed, this is all a lie. But most people never get to the next level of recognition, which is the most important level of that recognition. And that level of recognition is joy, which is after you realize hoaxed, cynical-- hoaxed, mad, cynicism, bitterness, the next level is, oh, so it's a hoax, and so I don't have to take it seriously.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Yeah.
RUPAUL: I can have fun with it. Don't take any of it seriously. And then you can have the joy. That is when your life will begin. Now, replay this tape back, so you can hear what I just said to you, because that's what drag is. Drag says, look, now I'm this, I'm this. The ego does not like that, the ego says, bitch, you better choose an identity, and stick with it, because I've got shampoo and beer I want to sell to you.
RICKY CAMILLERI: The ego doesn't like the moment. The ego doesn't like being in the moment. Yeah.
RUPAUL: No. And the moment is where you hear the universe's stage direction. And sometimes the stage direction says, bitch, you're a drag queen. And you're like, wait a minute, no. In fact, you know, when I quit downtown, I was working in clubs, at Pyramid, and Danceteria, and Mars, and all those clubs. And some friends of mine had-- because I was up in the club, if you know what I mean, OK? Some friends of mine had jumped ahead of line and become famous. And I thought, no, wait, no, I was before them.
And so I got very serious. And said, you know what, I'm going to leave clubs behind, I'm going to quit doing all the partying, and I'm going to focus on my career. So I thought, OK, I've got to be David Bowie. So I did a few gigs here and there, and people said, that's cute Ru, but when are you going to do Star Booty again, when are you going to do your drag thing again? It occurred to me that I could do it in drag.
I thought, no, you can't become famous in drag. But, I said, where did I get that idea? I had placed it there. The biggest-- I'm going to say something very important to you guys, and I know we have to quit soon, but something-- the most important thing you're going to hear today, which is, the biggest obstacles I have ever faced were the ones placed there by me. See, now, roll the tape back. Say, the biggest obstacles I have ever faced, and, bitch, I have faced some obstacles, the biggest ones were placed by me. The day I realized, who said I couldn't do it in drag? Who said-- I must have put that there.
So when the universe speaks to you, don't second guess, and go, that'll never work, that'll never work. It's like, listen, listen to it, and put it into motion. Child, I have turned drag into a multi-million dollar business. Hellalalala. And let me tell you, all these girls who've been on our show, they are out there making serious coinage. And I tell them all, I say, you know what, at the reunion they're about to go off into, you know what I say, it's like, number one, number one, pay your taxes, number two--
[LAUGHTER]
I do-- I absolutely do. Number two is don't read the comments, don't read the comments. Those are just people up in the cheap-- Brené Brown says, there are millions of cheap seats up there with people who will never-- they will never come down in this arena and be the warrior, and say, you know what, this is who I am, you like it, cool, if you don't, that's cool, they will never be. They're just, pa, pa, pa, pa, pa, pa, pa. I ain't studying them. I wasn't studying them before social media, and I sho' ain't studying them now.
[LAUGHTER]
Let the church say amen. It's the truth. Oh, my God, we're in Tower Records. This is Tower Records. I've spent so much time-- I'm embarrassed. If you knew, you would actually create an intervention for me.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Do you remember the first-- do you remember the first recording you bought in here?
RUPAUL: Yes-- not in here, but the first record I bought, that I owned, I don't know where it came from, but it was mine, was The Spinners, "Could It Be I'm Falling In Love?"
RICKY CAMILLERI: Oh, wow.
RUPAUL: Yeah. A great record. A great-- Thom Bell wrote and produced that, probably with Linda Creed, probably. But I am a music freak. Music has always been my sanctuary. I love it. Love it.
RICKY CAMILLERI: I'm curious, you know, when you said that you create, you were the one that created the barriers for yourself. Did you-- and you talked about doing drag, and how that was a barrier for a minute. When you created "Drag Race," and even creating "RuPaul," did you feel like you had to get past something? Like, did you ever think, oh, drag will never be mainstream enough, I'll never be able to do this, and then you had to sort of be like, no, it's a good idea, we have to do it?
RUPAUL: No, you know, the best ideas are actually already in you. And the things I'm talking about here, this isn't something you have to learn, these are things you have to remember. You already know this. You were born to this. I'm preaching up in here this evening, I really am.
RICKY CAMILLERI: I love it. As you said that you ask questions to learn more for yourself, I do the exact same thing. This is an incredibly selfish space for me.
RUPAUL: Good.
RICKY CAMILLERI: I'm just trying to learn.
RUPAUL: If you're not going to be selfish, who you're going to be somebody-elfish? I mean, come on. You know?
RICKY CAMILLERI: Did you just-- did you just coin that?
RUPAUL: I did, yeah.
RICKY CAMILLERI: That's--
RUPAUL: Thank you.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Can we-- let's t-shirt that one?
RUPAUL: Let's do that.
RICKY CAMILLERI: That's a good one.
RUPAUL: Up there with things that people have-- girl, you have gagged me, or something like-- I don't remember it. But, you know, these are not things that you have to learn, these are things that you already know. You have to be reminded. "Animal Farm," you forgot why we had a revolution in the first place. It's almost, you know, the Alan Watts stuff, which was very popular a few years ago, it's kind of disappeared again. But the philosopher Alan Watts has a theory-- how much time we got? I'm up in here. Child.
He has this theory that, say if you were given the gift, every time you went to sleep at night, to decide what you wanted to dream. And that when you wake up in the morning, you'd be you again, and it's OK. So for the first two months you'd probably go, oh, I want to be a princess, oh, I want to be a multi-billionaire, oh, I want to be able to find one.
After a while, you get bored with that, and you say, you know what? If I'm going to be whole and unchanged when I wake up in the morning, let's do a random thing, let's do a shuffle, anything you want, and one day you might be a serial killer, you might be a-- you name it, I mean, something that's really weird, and gross, or that you wouldn't want to do. But you know that when you wake up in the morning, you'd be unchanged. He says, that's actually what we're doing.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Yeah.
RUPAUL: This life you're living right now, do it, live it, love it, love somebody, give somebody some love, allow yourself to be loved, do whatever you want, and as long as you don't hurt nobody-- that's my thing, you don't--
RICKY CAMILLERI: Don't be the serial killer.
RUPAUL: Don't be the-- well, you can, you can, but the thing is, the truth is, whatever happens, you'll be unchanged. So when the universe says, bitch, you're a drag queen, say, OK, I'll do that, go. But that's why I say, you know, there is a frequency that you are connected to, there is your path, most of this time we're not present for it. That's a keyword, being present. Most of the time we're not present for it. So we're fighting against, we're trying to make something happen that ain't never going to happen, because you're working against it.
The things that are for you are all ready for you. Your angels are sitting around you waiting, saying, you have free will, we're just waiting for you to say please help me, and then we can swoop in and get ya, we can get ya, but you've got to say the words, you have free will. So I said all that to say, it's not something you have to learn, it's something you have to remember. You have the knowledge, Luke. Go for the-- what's the-- go for the force-- use the force, Luke. Use the force. Use it. It's there for you.
RICKY CAMILLERI: I like, go for the force more.
RUPAUL: Go for the force. Gag for the 4th, Luke.
RICKY CAMILLERI: If you're not going to be selfish, be elfish.
RUPAUL: If you're not going to be selfish Luke, be something else on-- go use the 4th and Broadway, Luke. Use the 4th.
RICKY CAMILLERI: I think we have time for a few questions. Who has a question? Hey.
RUPAUL: Now, make it a good question, because if it's not a good question, I'm going to embarrass you, and I'mma-- I really am.
- Question. How's it going, Ru?
RUPAUL: Hi, baby.
- Among all your celebrity guests in the RuPaul's Drag Show, which one has been the most impacted you in one way or another?
RUPAUL: Well, OK, that's [INAUDIBLE]. You said "Drag Race," but, you know, on the talk show, the most impactful person, which is starting Monday, June 10th on Fox stations, tune in. And--
RICKY CAMILLERI: For three weeks, right?
RUPAUL: Three weeks.
RICKY CAMILLERI: And people should tune in, and they should tweet at you, and get on Facebook at you, and stuff.
RUPAUL: That is right. It's a test run. And I've had lots of test runs. Mostly, you know, I do lots of things. Most things, they don't stick. Some things stick. We'd love for this to stick. But if it's not, you know, but I love this show. On the show, we have lots of celebrities, but there is one episode where a mother, whose son comes out to her, has a hard time with it. And eventually she gets reborn. And she's a very heavy Christian woman, but at one point she comes reborn and realizes how blessed she is to have the son.
She then turns into a surrogate for couples who are getting married to be a stand-in parent for them, because the couple's parents don't want to come to the wedding, or they have some issue with it, so she becomes a stand-in parent at these weddings. I think, wow, you want to talk about a rebirth, you want to talk about someone who-- who dies to their old self, and is reborn into their higher self. This person really touched me. And I love her. And that is the story of each of us.
The reason that the Christ figure, or the Buddha, or Krishna, resonates so much with us is because it is the death and the rebirth into your [INAUDIBLE]. That's what we're all doing, by the way. That's what we are all doing. And if you're not doing that, you better check yourself, because you're playing yourself.
- Thank you, Ru.
RUPAUL: Thank you.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Next question. Oh.
- Hello, RuPaul.
RUPAUL: You have a good question for me?
- I hope so.
RUPAUL: Now, don't stand on my camera now. Are you-- is that the spot? Are you in the good spot?
- [INAUDIBLE]
RUPAUL: OK.
- Is there something that get you nervous, or anxious? And what do you do to overcome that situation?
RUPAUL: That's a great question. What's your name? Where are you from?
- Gilberto from Mexico.
RUPAUL: From-- Gilberto from Mexico. And what was his name? You know him. What's his name?
- Roman.
RUPAUL: What is it?
- Roman. He's my husband.
RUPAUL: I know, but what's his name?
- Roman.
RUPAUL: Rodman?
- Roman.
RUPAUL: Oh, Roman, like the Roman candle. Yeah, OK. And you're both from Mexico?
- No, he's from Honduras. Well, he--
RUPAUL: Honduras. Oh, that's-- I know. He said that already.
- OK.
RUPAUL: So, yeah. So is there anything that makes me nervous? You know what makes me nervous? The only thing that makes me anxious-- and I am an introvert masquerading as an extrovert. I'm-- I really am a to myself kind of person. What makes me nervous is ignorance. Ignorance and people who are not in their bodies, like zombies. And you see them walking around, look at all those people out there on their phones, just-- this is New York City, the greatest city in the world, and they're doing this. That means they are not present. And people who are unconscious, they make me nervous.
Now, going on stage and stuff, that doesn't make me nervous. You know, even on this talk show, I tell the people-- which the talk show, by the way, it's like my own living room, it's like at my house. My house looks like that. Actually, I have that couch in my living room, but it's bright, bright, bright, bright orange. I always think of it as my living room, because my mother, I would perform for my mother in the living room, and she would love whatever I did-- I was terrible. But she would love whatever it-- whatever I'd do, she'd love it.
So whenever I go on stage, I think, OK, mama's living room. So just go out there and be yourself. You know, what are they going to do? Eat you? They're not going to eat you. Everything's fine. Listen, if I have fun, the audience will have fun. And so far, I've had a great time today.
[APPLAUSE]
Thank you, Gilberto. And look at this lovely lady here, you've been giving me so much love all--
- You feel it?
RUPAUL: Yes, I absolutely do. What's your name? And where are you from?
- Happy pride, first and foremost.
RUPAUL: Thank you.
- I can't tell you my name right away. We actually know each other from over 27 years ago. We know of each other.
RUPAUL: OK.
- I'll tell you after the show.
RUPAUL: OK.
- But--
RUPAUL: Is there illegal substances involved?
- No. The dead name and the new name. My name is Calell now. I used to be Fabian Blue. We used to have the same producer back in-- Erick Cupper back in the '90s.
RUPAUL: Oh, yes, I remember Fabian Blue.
- He's gone now. And thanks to you, and just being fabulous, and out there, I just came out three years ago, so this is brand new.
RUPAUL: Wow. Condragulations.
- At 48-year-old, so a little late, but better late than never. My question for you is, what should the role for the queer community be in the resistance? We're living in this handmaid's tale life right now. Please, what can we do to resist?
RUPAUL: That is a great question. Thank you so much for that question. She asks, what can the LGBTQ community do to help the resistance? This is it. What we have-- we have something that they don't have. We have a secret weapon. Our secret weapon is this.
Our secret weapon is love, music, laughter, joy. We have colors. We have dancing. We have creativity. We have our imaginations. And those things don't discredit the-- those are wrong, huge, powerful moving forces, that's how we inspire. We have spirit. That's what we have to change this world. And it is-- this metamorphosis, it's a violent, really gross experience.
But the truth is, once we get through this-- pendulum always swings-- once we get through this, we will be this beautiful butterfly as you are today, my darling. Absolutely. And that's something each of us can do. Hold on to the laughter. Stay in the joy. That is our secret weapon. They don't have that. They don't have that, because they are stuck in this-- they are like those zombies, they're like this ghost that keeps thinking it's the 20th century.
It's not the 20th century anymore. We're moving forward. And it's through our joy, and our beauty, and our love, and our dancing. Why are there no more discos? What happened to discos? We used to dance. We used to dance, everywhere there was dancing. There's no more dancing. What is that? Is it a conspiracy? I don't know. But I want to dance, I'll tell you that.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Does the fact that you have this show, and that you have "Drag Race," and the fact that everything is a bit more mainstream make you more positive and optimistic about the future, and the idea that we are just sort of living in a glitch in the moment, and that everything is actually still progressing forward?
RUPAUL: Yes. Yes and no. You know, people are still people. I don't care how many smartphones you own, or how many-- at the base of everyone, we all want to be loved. We all, unfortunately, the ego needs to be recognized. There's this sinking feeling in each of us that we really don't exist. So we go, and we create lives on Instagram, or we say something provocative on social media, so someone gets mad and says, you, you, and we're like, yeah, tell me more, yeah, I must be existing, because you're mad at me, you know? There's this thing.
So humans are still basically humans. And the truth is, yes, you do exist, but nothing from the outside world is going to tell you that. You can only-- you can only gain that knowledge from the inside, and from what you're doing from the inside out. So yes, there is-- there is a really dark darkness, there's a darkness that is in my peripheral-- there, I said it. Peripheral-- I said it again. Peripheral vision. I didn't say it the third time. I have a hard time with that word, peripheral-- and Massachushits.
Yeah. There is this darkness. And, you know, when I was 28-- you know, Saturn returns to the place it was born when you turn 28. Actually, every seven years there's a regeneration, right? And it was so dark for me at 28-- I was sleeping on my sister's couch. 28-year-old. Sleeping on my baby sister's couch in Los Angeles, no car, not a dime to my name, no overstatement, not a dime to my name.
Anyway, I made it through that, because my tribe members, Larry T. Called me up. I was in San Diego at my mother's house, and he called me up, and he said, Ru, get your ass back here to New York. Get your ass back here to New York. And it was like Dorothy in "The Wizard of Oz" where they said, wake up, Dorothy, wake up, don't forget who you are, do not forget who you are. Don't forget who you are.
So you need your tribe members to wake you up. Don't forget. Come, come. And he woke-- and I came back here to New York. But I'm just going to go back-- Saturn returns. It was so dark. When I look back at it, what I remember the most is that I dug my feet in, dark clouds always come bad, but they always move over. I dug my feet in, and I stayed put, and I waited for it to be over. And when it was over, I realized I had muscles of steel, muscles of steel, wasn't nothing going to come for me after that. I'd been through the worst of it.
And another time, once you turn-- after you turn 40, most of the worst things have already happened to you, so you can-- you can breeze on for the rest of your life. But these dark clouds, the dark clouds will pass. Darkness cannot survive in the presence of Judith Light.
[LAUGHTER]
[APPLAUSE]
RICKY CAMILLERI: RuPaul, what a pleasure, what an honor to sit and talk to you today. You are the pioneer, the icon.
[CHEERING]
RUPAUL: Finally.
RICKY CAMILLERI: Let's say, before I let you go, "RuPaul" premieres this Monday on Fox television stations across the country for three weeks.
RUPAUL: Jesus, it's like pulling teeth to get a compliment out of him.
RICKY CAMILLERI: RuPaul, everybody. Let's hear it.
[CHEERING]
RUPAUL: Thank you. Thank you.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
