The Muppets sit down with Brett Goldstein to reminisce about making The Muppet Christmas Carol
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We're more the "God bless us every one" types than "Bah, humbug" contrarians here at EW.
And that means that one of our favorite holiday traditions is sitting down to watch 1992's The Muppet Christmas Carol, an adaptation of Charles Dickens' classic work starring Michael Caine as Ebenezer Scrooge and the Muppets as the remaining cast of characters, including Gonzo as Dickens himself.
Jacqueline Jones/The Muppets Studio
The classic, which uses more of Dickens' original text than any other cinematic adaptation, turns 30 this holiday season — and in honor of 30 years of Kermit watching a shooting star, Miss Piggy taste-testing the Christmas goose, and Gonzo and Rizzo slamming into the side of a chapel, we got the gang back together to reminisce about their memories making the film.
To oversee the merriment, we recruited No. 1 Muppets' fan Brett Goldstein, Ted Lasso's costar and writer (and if you haven't watched his one-man Muppet Christmas Carol, get thee to YouTube stat).
Watch the video above, or read a complete transcript below. Let's honor Christmas in our hearts, and try to keep it all the year, as Kermit, Miss Piggy, Robin, and Gonzo take us — and Goldstein — through their Christmases Past, Present, and Future.
Jacqueline Jones/The Muppets Studio
BRETT GOLDSTEIN: Hello, and welcome to Entertainment Weekly's Around the Table. My name is Brett Goldstein. I'm an actor, a writer, a director, a plumber, and I love the Muppets. Sure, Citizen Kane and Vertigo are good films, but I think we can all agree that, objectively, the greatest film of all time is The Muppet Christmas Carol. It is my huge honor and great delight that I am joined today by the original cast of The Muppet Christmas Carol to reminisce and talk about the 30th anniversary of that masterpiece. What a joy to see you all — you haven't aged a bit. Do you have a favorite memory or moment from the film? Should we start with you, Kermit?
KERMIT: For me, the best memory, it's being together. It was the first movie that we'd made in quite a few years. It gave us a chance to play and to have fun. It's the best part of everything we do. Isn't that right, guys?
MISS PIGGY: For me, It was how Sir Michael Caine let me borrow his Oscar. Mikey, I promise I will give it back to you very soon… maybe.
ROBIN: My favorite part was when Tiny Tim did not die.
GOLDSTEIN: Oh, man. I think a lot of people really, really, really like that part.
KERMIT: Gonzo?
GONZO: My favorite part? Being Charles Dickens, a great author whose last name rhymes with chickens. Let's face it. I was perfect for the part.
KERMIT: You sure were.
GOLDSTEIN: Was that how they sold you on it, Gonzo? They just said, "Do this, it rhymes with chickens," and you were like, "I'm in"?
GONZO: Yeah, plus I got to go to London.
GOLDSTEIN: What was that like?
GONZO: Oh, it's great. I've been there a lot before, but I love it. I got lots of friends there. I go out in the country and visit farms. Piggy and I go out and visit farms together.
MISS PIGGY: What?
GONZO: I visit the chickens. She visits the pigs.
MISS PIGGY: That is not true! You're making things up.
KERMIT: Maybe move on to the next question, Brett, before things get heated.
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GOLDSTEIN: Thank you, Kermit, for keeping things on track. Do you guys have a favorite moment in the film?
KERMIT: The skating on the ice. That was a lot of fun, especially for a frog. We haven't had ice in the swamp since the pre-Cambrian era, so that was a real treat for me.
GOLDSTEIN: You were a very good skater.
GONZO: And you're very old too.
KERMIT: What?
GONZO: Well, you go back to the pre-Cambrian era.
KERMIT: No, no, no, no. I'm just saying that we have not had ice in the swamp since then. That's what I've been told. It's old frog lore. Don't you have any lore from your… whatevers?
GONZO: I don't know any other whatevers.
KERMIT: How about Robin, what about you? Do you have a favorite moment from the film?
ROBIN: Oh, gee. There was so many. I liked the whole movie. Actually one of the most difficult parts for me was pretending that Uncle Kermit was my father. I kept calling him, "Uncle Kermit," instead of Father Dad.
KERMIT: That's okay. You did a great job.
MISS PIGGY: I think my favorite moment was letting loose on Scrooge and telling him what I thought of him. Everybody credits those three ghosts for changing his attitude, but I think it was moi yelling at him that really made him change.
GOLDSTEIN: That sounds right.
GONZO: My favorite moment was flying across London with the Ghost of Christmas Past. You really haven't lived until you've hit a church steeple at 60 miles an hour.
MISS PIGGY: I don't know, I've never done that and I feel like I've lived.
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GOLDSTEIN: Which Muppet would you say is the biggest Scrooge?
KERMIT: Well, Brett, sometimes Statler and Waldorf, who play Marley and Marley, they can be a lot like Scrooge. But the truth is, they're really good guys. Don't you guys think they are?
GONZO: Well, they must be. They come to every one of our performances.
KERMIT: That's right.
ROBIN: I always thought they were being punished for something.
KERMIT: No.
MISS PIGGY: As for the spirit of Christmas, though, I would have to say that Kermit captures that. I really do. Yes, Kermit and I have our differences, but he's still the kindest, sweetest frog I know.
KERMIT: It kind of feels like there's a "but" coming.
MISS PIGGY: Why but? No but.
KERMIT: No but?
MISS PIGGY: He could stand to wear some clothes every now and then.
KERMIT: I knew it was coming — there you go.
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GOLDSTEIN: One of the things I love about the film is it's genuinely pretty scary. Was there anything you held back on?
KERMIT: Well, we were a little bit worried about the ghost of Christmas Yet to Come. It's a very frightening character. Fun fact here, and this is a scoop, Brett, but I actually was up for that part.
GOLDSTEIN: Really?
KERMIT: Yeah. But when Michael Caine turned around and saw me, he couldn't stop giggling so we changed it up a bit there.
MISS PIGGY: Yeah, you're not very intimidating.
GONZO: You're reassuring.
ROBIN: I just had to cover my eyes during that whole part. In fact, Mr. Brett, please let me know when you're done with this question.
GOLDSTEIN: Okay, I will.
ROBIN: I'm going to hide behind my cocoa.
GONZO: Well, I think the scariest part of making the movie was at the table read when Miss Piggy found out she wasn't playing the lead.
MISS PIGGY: Yeah, sure, I would've preferred being the lead actress, but I was willing to settle for a Best Supporting Actress award. Not that I got one.
GONZO: But in the moment, it was scary. She's not telling it quite right.
ROBIN: This isn't as scary as I thought it was going to be.
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GOLDSTEIN: You can come out from behind the cup. What's your favorite song in the film? Do you have a favorite?
ROBIN: Oh, I enjoy the overture by Mr. Paul Williams. It opens with the mournful clarinet, but also "Thankful Heart."
KERMIT: Yeah, they're all great, in my opinion. It all comes down to our good friend Paul Williams. It was the first time that we'd worked with him since The Muppet Movie. Paul, he's always been able to take a special feeling and turn it into beautiful music. If you ask me, Paul and [composer] Miles Goodman made every one of those songs a new classic.
MISS PIGGY: Oh, I agree with Kermit, but if I had to pick one song, then I choose, "It Feels Like Christmas." I've always believed that every day should feel like Christmas: joy, glad tidings, and especially —
KERMIT: Lots of presents.
MISS PIGGY: That's right, Kermit. How did you know?
KERMIT: Well, I've known you a long time.
GOLDSTEIN: What about you, Gonzo? What's your favorite song?
GONZO Well, I'm with Kermit. They're all great songs. I'm a little bit disappointed, though, that my big solo number, "I'm Charles Dickens and You're Not," got cut from the final film.
GOLDSTEIN: You all live in Hollywood?
MISS PIGGY: Sometimes.
KERMIT: I'm bicoastal.
GOLDSTEIN: What was it like filming in snowy London?
KERMIT: Oh, wow. We love London. Yeah, we shot the original Muppet Show there. It's always felt like a second home to us.
ROBIN: For me, I loved playing in the snow and sledding. We don't get to do much sledding in the swamp.
KERMIT: No.
ROBIN: You try to sled and you just sink in the water.
MISS PIGGY: I adore London. Being there gives moi a chance to catch up with the Royal family.
KERMIT: You saw the Royal family while we were making the film?
MISS PIGGY: Well, they were out of town while we were making the film.
GONZO: I just love London. Where else can you eat food with names like Bubble and Squeak, Mucky Drippings and Rumpty-Thumps?
KERMIT: I think we all agree, we really love London.
GOLDSTEIN: Well, I'm glad to hear it. You're welcome back any time. That's coming from me and the Royals.
MISS PIGGY: See? They know me.
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GOLDSTEIN: Listen, when I hang out with the Royals, pretty much all they talk about is Miss Piggy, and that's the truth.
KERMIT: Really?
MISS PIGGY: How do you like them apples?
GONZO: I'm just going to ignore you.
GOLDSTEIN: Do any of you know why this film is such an enduring classic?
MISS PIGGY: Because I'm in it. Next question!
KERMIT: There is that, Miss Piggy, but I think that it's such a perfect story about redemption and being grateful for everything that life has given you.
GONZO: As Charles Dickens, let me just say, thank you for the compliment.
GOLDSTEIN: This was the first film that the Muppets had made that was not an original story. What was it about A Christmas Carol that made you guys think, This is a good fit for the Muppets?
KERMIT: Well, we'd always wanted to do a Christmas movie, and for a story, you can't do any better than Dickens' A Christmas Carol. Right? Redemption, gratitude, and you mix that with the Muppets' silliness and you've got yourself a good fit.
MISS PIGGY: To be honest, I really wanted to do, It's a Wonderful Moi, but there was a lot of pushback. I wasn't going to jump off a bridge or anything, anyhow, so it's just as well.
GONZO: Well, I think it was a good fit because of two words: public domain. As Charles Dickens, I know. They didn't have to pay me a cent.
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GOLDSTEIN: So Gonzo, playing Charles Dickens is not the normal part you are known for playing. What challenges did portraying that writer give you?
GONZO: The handwriting. Quill pens can make a lot of curlicues and flourishes. To be honest, I had to use a stunt calligrapher.
KERMIT: I didn't know they had those.
GOLDSTEIN: There's a whole union for them. Kermit. This is the first Muppet movie where you weren't the lead. I think you're absolutely fabulous as Bob Cratchit. Was that a difficult adjustment? Was there any pushback from you about the decision not to be the lead?
KERMIT: Oh, no, no, no. I understand Bob Cratchit. He always gets overwhelmed and he tries to hold things together no matter how crazy things get. That is exactly what I do with the Muppets. That worked for me.
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GOLDSTEIN: Miss Piggy, you play Bob's wife, Emily, and you really disappear into the part.
MISS PIGGY: Is that a good thing?
GOLDSTEIN: Yeah, it's an incredible performance.
MISS PIGGY: Because usually that's not a good thing. That's not what I aim for it. My talent shines through and calls attention to moi.
KERMIT: Yeah. She wants to be as visible as possible at all times.
GOLDSTEIN: Right. Was it difficult to be... I don't know how to put this. What I think is impressive is it's not that big a part or that glamorous a part. I wondered if any of that was difficult.
MISS PIGGY: Well, yes. Of course, I was concerned. But Dickens here refused to change the story, so I just threw myself into the part. I just searched for the inner goodness of a strong, loving woman who perseveres despite her hardships and limited wardrobe.
GONZO: Well, Brett, when I wrote it, I wasn't really anticipating a pig.
KERMIT: Were you anticipating a chicken?
GONZO: Of course.
GOLDSTEIN: Robin, if I could talk to you for a second?
ROBIN: Yes, please.
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GOLDSTEIN: You play Bob and Emily's son, Tiny Tim. It's a heartbreaking performance. I can't hear the sound of coughing without crying. I wondered how difficult it was to achieve that performance, whether there were versions you tried in rehearsal that you didn't use?
ROBIN: Well, I tried one interpretation of Tiny Tim, where he was a WWE wrestler and wrestled Mr. Scrooge. That got pretty quickly rejected. But as for the cough, well, growing up in a swamp, coughing is easy, especially when the horsefly goes down a wrong pipe [Coughs]. Excuse me.
GOLDSTEIN: Oh, Robin, please don't cough.
ROBIN: I'm sorry, Mr. Brett.
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GOLDSTEIN: Let's talk about Michael Caine. One of the great performances of all time. He should have won an Oscar for that. What was it like working with him? Did you learn anything from him? Did he learn anything from you guys?
GONZO: Well, what I remember about working with Michael was having a sore neck. He was very tall and I always had to look up at him.
KERMIT: Michael was fantastic. He took the role very seriously, which is hard to do when you're surrounded by singing bears and pigs and whatevers. He seemed to enjoy working with us from the very first day.
ROBIN: He even came back the second day.
KERMIT: That's right.
MISS PIGGY: That's how you know he's a great actor.
GOLDSTEIN: So tell me how the music came about. Was Paul Williams left to his own devices, or did any of you help?
KERMIT: Well, yeah, Paul, he read the original story and the script. In fact, he may be the only one who ever did read the script.
MISS PIGGY: There was a script?
KERMIT: Anyway, like I said, Paul has got an incredibly amazing ability to take feelings and take a moment and emotion and turn it into the perfect song. And all we had to do is sing. Right?
ROBIN: And try to stay in tune.
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GOLDSTEIN: Kermit, do you still count the number of sleeps until Christmas?
KERMIT: Oh, of course, doesn't everybody?
ROBIN: Boy, I sure do.
MISS PIGGY: For moi, every day is Christmas.
GONZO: Yeah, she's very big on getting presents. Brett, I just hope you brought some.
MISS PIGGY: Oh, did you bring me a present?
GOLDSTEIN: Uh…
KERMIT: [leans over to whisper] Say it's in the car.
GOLDSTEIN: I did, and it's in the car, and when I leave I'll get it.
MISS PIGGY: Oh, good, I can't wait, I can't wait.
GOLDSTEIN: Robin and Kermit, the Christmas scat that you do, I could listen to an entire album of that. How do you feel about it?
ROBIN: It was great fun. Did you know the whole thing was improvised? But it was based in part on that old Amphibian holiday folk song, "Froggy Went a Scat Singing."
KERMIT: Yeah, yeah. We all learned it as tadpoles, and I'm pretty sure that that's available on Splashify.
GOLDSTEIN: Can we get a snippet? Three, two, one…
KERMIT AND ROBIN: Froggy went a scattin', he did ride, ribbit, ribbit...
KERMIT: Do you want to keep singing? It's the same words over and over.
GOLDSTEIN: I don't want you two to ever stop.
KERMIT: It's very repetitive.
ROBIN: It's a folk song.
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GOLDSTEIN: Robin, "Bless Us All" is such an emotional song. I can't hear it without crying. How do you get through it?
ROBIN: Aw. Well, gee, I was so nervous, I just wanted to get it right. But gee whiz, if you need to have a good cry here, you can borrow my hanky.
GOLDSTEIN: Thank you very much.
ROBIN: Okay, here we go. [Begins to sing "Bless Us All"]
KERMIT: No, no, no. We don't want Brett to cry.
ROBIN: Oh gee, I'm sorry, Mr. Brett.
GOLDSTEIN: It's all right. You have a real power.
KERMIT: It does feel good though, doesn't it?
GOLDSTEIN: Yeah. Gonzo, you are famously a stunt artist and you put your body through a lot in this film, falling out of windows, smashing into churches, all sorts of things. But actually, Rizzo is put through a lot worse. What was the biggest injury you sustained on set? And what was the hardest stunt to film?
GONZO: You know, as an actor, I use the Stanislavski method. He always told us, "If it doesn't hurt, it's not acting, and if it does hurt, you don't have to act."
KERMIT: Wait a second, Gonzo. You're saying that you learned that from Stanislavski?
GONZO: Yep, good old Crash Stanislavski.
KERMIT: Different Stanislavski. Okay, got it. I'm sorry, Brett. Next question.
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GOLDSTEIN: Okay. Can we talk about the song "When Love Is Gone"? There were some times when it was cut, sometimes it was back in. What do you guys think? Is that song canon?
GONZO: Well, if I had any idea it was cannon, I would have made them keep it in the movie.
MISS PIGGY: I still say it would have been better if I sang it.
KERMIT: You say that about every song, and Gonzo, it's a different kind of cannon.
GONZO: Oh, not the boom boom?
KERMIT: No, not the boom boom.
GOLDSTEIN: Thanks for clearing that up. You guys did A Christmas Carol, you did Treasure Island, you did The Wizard of Oz. Is there another classic you would like to adapt, and can I please pitch that we make Muppets Pride and Prejudice?
MISS PIGGY: Ooh, yes! Pride and Prejudice, I'd love to do that. Brett, you've got pull in this town. Can you get Pride and Prejudice and Piggy green-lit?
GOLDSTEIN: I think you and me together. I play Darcy, you play —
MISS PIGGY: Elizabeth. Yes, oh, that would be perfect.
GOLDSTEIN: I mean, let's see how much pull you and me together as a package has in this town, and I think we're going to be very surprised.
GONZO: I think you've got pull, but Piggy has push.
MISS PIGGY: What's that supposed to mean?
GONZO: No, it's just technique.
MISS PIGGY: Yeah, I have lots of technique.
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GOLDSTEIN: I hope you don't think this is weird, but this film is my Christmas tradition. I watch it every Christmas Eve. Do you have a favorite holiday tradition?
KERMIT: Getting together with friends.
GONZO: Falling down the chimney.
MISS PIGGY AND ROBIN: Opening my presents!
ROBIN: Oh, haha!
MISS PIGGY: I guess we have the same tradition.
GOLDSTEIN: The message of the story is to keep the generous spirit of Christmas in your heart all year round. What are the ways you try to do that or would encourage others to do?
KERMIT: Well, I would encourage people to spread the spirit with gratitude. Be thankful every day for your family and friends, whether they are frogs or pigs or bears or humans. And if we appreciate all of that, everything that we've got, it will be a much happier world.
ROBIN: You took my answer, Uncle Kermit.
KERMIT: Well, you know, I think it's kind of a universal answer.
ROBIN: It's a good one.
MISS PIGGY: I think you can keep Christmas in your heart all year round, and it's easy. Especially if you never take down your decorations.
KERMIT: That is true.
GONZO: Well, I would say love yourself and appreciate the weirdness in others.
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GOLDSTEIN: One quick question, what is the best line in cinema history, and is it, "No cheeses for us meeses?"
ROBIN: No, it's "Every time a bell rings, an angel gets its wings."
KERMIT: That's pretty good there. I've got, "Here's looking at you, kid." That's pretty good, right? That's my Bogart.
ROBIN: What is that?
KERMIT: That's Humphrey Bogart.
GONZO: Those are great, but my favorite is, "You're going to need a bigger boat."
MISS PIGGY: Or, how about, "All right, Mr. DeMille. I'm ready for my close up."
GOLDSTEIN: Muppet Sunset Boulevard?
MISS PIGGY: Ooh, I like it. We'll pitch that one at the same time as we pitch Pride and Prejudice.
GOLDSTEIN: What a double bill.
KERMIT: Good luck to you.
GOLDSTEIN: Thank you. You going to produce?
KERMIT: Oh sure, if you'll have me.
GOLDSTEIN: 100 percent.
KERMIT: All right, let's do it. I think the package is getting better and better.
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GOLDSTEIN: It really is. That is all we have time for today. I want to thank the Muppets for making my dream come true. You can watch The Muppet Christmas Carol on Disney+, complete with "When Love Is Gone." My name's Brett Goldstein, and this has been EW's Around the Table. Have a wonderful holiday, and lastly, Robin?
ROBIN: God bless us every one!
KERMIT: That was so nice, Robin.
ROBIN: You know what would also be nice, Uncle Kermit?
KERMIT: What's that?
ROBIN: [Begins to sing "Bless Us All"]
KERMIT: Come on, Brett, sing out!
The Muppet Christmas Carol is now available on Disney+ and the full-length version, including "Where Love Is Gone," can be found in the Extras section of the menu.
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