The march to getting ‘Rustin’ made: David Permut may take Barack and Michelle Obama to the Oscars
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David Permut is having a good day. “Rustin,” which he executive produced (he prefers “shepherded” and is quick to name his colleagues) got two important Golden Globe nominations, Best Film Drama Actor for Colman Domingo and Best Original Song for Lenny Kravitz‘s “Road to Freedom.” His other current project is the television series “Lawmen: Bass Reeves” for which David Oyelowo nabbed a nom.
When we talked he was about to go into a screening, one of 50 he says he views during festival season. He is open about his own personal life as a gay producer in Hollywood. Even teaches me some Yiddish. And he’s proud to have worked alongside two relative newcomers in the producer business, Barack and Michelle Obama. The president posthumously awarded Bayard Rustin, an openly gay African-American, the Presidential Medal of Freedom in 2013 for his instrumental role in the 1963 March on Washington, and now the Obamas’ Higher Ground production company has spearheaded the civil rights leader’s biopic.
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Permut is candid about the current atmosphere in Hollywood, his Oscar beginnings and his next project. Spoiler: It’s a true story. He likes those. But the most salient talking point at the moment is the Netflix film.
GD: ‘Rustin’ is such an important story. What took so long?
DP: (Laughs) What took so long, yeah. Well because it’s been 14 years of my journey on the project. It started with a film I made with Sigourney Weaver called “Prayers for Bobby” about a gay teenage suicide which was nominated for Emmys and a GLAAD Award and got a lot of attention in 2009. It was a cable movie I did with Chris Taffe and Dan Sladek and Chris said to me, “Do you know who Bayard Rustin is?” And I hadn’t, and he told me the story and I was astounded.
GD: You, Chris and David are gay. Was this a story that was known in the gay community and not really outside of it?
DP: Well look the reality is he became a forgotten hero. At least until the release of our film, which makes me very proud. He disappeared in history because homosexuality in the ’60s politically made some people distance themselves from Bayard Rustin. He was a member of two minorities being Black and revealed as a homosexual even though he was an “out” gay man. And he became invisible. And in a “sea of no’s,” which is common in this business, you have to be impervious to rejection. In life too.
GD: So was 14 years of rejection because Hollywood wasn’t ready to tell a Black gay hero story?
DP: Well I think in part, yes. I think at the time some people were not ready to hear it. But there was one common phrase that came back from everybody we talked to: “Who is Bayard Rustin?” That was the common mantra.
GD: And ironically that’s the reason to make the movie. And here we are.
DP: That’s what I was just going to say. I made a movie called “Hacksaw Ridge” about another forgotten hero in history who won the Congressional Medal of Honor for never touching a gun but saving over 75 lives in the bloodiest battle in Okinawa. Nobody knew who he was and it got six Oscar nominations and two wins. They know now. So I am very attracted to true stories that have three things. I learned them from the oldest brother of the Warner Brothers, Harry Warner. Jack Warner was a shit. He only cared about selling popcorn. He was about commerce and he was not loved. But Harry felt the power of what we do in this business has the potential to do three things. He called them “the three E’s,” educate, enlighten, entertain. And the team who brought home this movie has done all three things.
GD: Yeah, what’s it like to have Barack and Michelle Obama as producing colleagues? Intimidating?
DP: Well all I can tell is in a “sea of no’s,” the key to the door was the man who not only knew who Bayard Rustin was, but also awarded him the Presidential Medal of Freedom posthumously at the White House. So after 14 years of “Who is Bayard Rustin?” when I heard President Obama was forming a production company that became the key to the door.
GD: Did Barack use any “presidential powers” to cast people or get any clearances? Did he call Chris Rock? Be honest.
DP: (Laughs) I don’t want to be on record with any of that.
GD: So that’s yes!
DP: I didn’t say yes! He was enormously supportive. They both were.
GD: Well obviously he was invested in the story.
DP: Yes, he introduced the film at Telluride and the world premiere at TIFF, this is his first narrative production.
GD: Yeah, he’s been behind at least one doc, right?
DP: Two actually. His first won the Oscar, “American Factory,” the second was nominated called “Crip Camp.”
GD: So will Barack Obama walk the Golden Globe red carpet?
DP: I have no idea.
GD: Would he walk the Oscar red carpet if you got nominated?
DP: Bill, I can’t tell you, I don’t know.
GD: Al Gore went when his doc was nominated. I interviewed him there.
DP: Okay well call Barack Obama and ask him. (Laughs) I can’t answer for him. I can only say we are all very proud of the production. The real credit goes to the people who physically made the film. As executive producer I shepherded the film. “Shepherded” is an important word because that’s what I did with Chris and Dan for so many years, so to be nominated — especially Colman Domingo, you talk about someone who embodied a role.
GD: I have to agree. He is amazing. Was anyone else even considered? Or was he always “the guy”?
DP: Well, he became the guy ultimately. You know over 14 years we had thought about other actors. But there’s a Yiddish word called “Bashert” meaning there’s no accidents in life. Things happen when they’re meant to happen. And “Rustin” for whatever reason wasn’t meant to happen 14 years ago, 10 years ago, eight years ago, six years ago. It was meant to happen now.
GD: Are there more movies coming about people of color and the LBGTQ+ community?
DP: It’s happening. And it’s become such an amazing experience for me personally. Another Golden Globe nominee today was David Oyelowo on a great new series with Taylor Sheridan called “Lawmen: Bass Reeves.” He was the first Black sheriff in this country who was formerly a slave. And his story from the 1800s was one that I shepherded for over 10 years. Started as a feature film and it was challenging to get it made. But it’s a hit series, one of the highest rated in Paramount’s recent history.
GD: Good producers pivot. Let me pivot. Do awards mean as much any more? The Globes? Even the Oscars? Are they as important today as they were even in 2016 for “Hacksaw”?
DP: Well they mean the world to us in this business. And then hopefully to the general public in terms of getting the word out. I think with the success of “Oppenheimer” and “Barbie” and the challenges with the pandemic and the strikes, people are going back to movies around the world for the communal experience. It’s there. It’s always gonna be there. The movie business is doing extraordinarily well given the circumstances.
GD: So if you’re nominated, you’re going to the Oscars.
DP: Well, we’ll see. You know the first time I went to the Oscars? 1976 with a movie I shot in one night on video and bumped over to film. Another true story about another President of the United States named Harry Truman. “Give ‘Em Hell, Harry” with James Whitmore. Released it ourselves because no studio would. And then lo and behold I get the call when I’m 20 years old, “Congratulations, your videotaped movie that you shot in one take has gotten an Oscar nomination for Best Actor.” So when I’m walking the red carpet for “Hacksaw Ridge” and someone says, “Do you have your speech ready?” I said, “I’ve had it ready since I’m 13 years old.”
GD: Before I let you go, let me guess, your next project is about a real person.
DP: (Laughs) I have an Academy Award-winning director and writer for “CODA.” It’s Sian Heder‘s next movie at Apple and it’s with me. It’s called “Being Heumann” based on the true story of Judy Huemann who was an activist who changed the world for the disabled community. When you go to a street corner in New York and you see the accessibility on the sidewalk for a wheelchair or braille on the elevators, think about her. In fact “Crip Camp,” the Obama-produced film, featured her in it.
Of course it did, David. That’s “bashert.” No accident.
Post Script: Today was also a good day for Permut with two Critics Choice nominations for “Rustin.”
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