In this episode of the Autoblog Podcast, Editor-in-Chief Greg Migliore is joined by Senior Editor Jeremy Korzeniewski and News Editor Joel Stocksdale. They're fresh off the show floor of the 2022 North American International Auto Show in Detroit, and they have a lot to talk about. From the seventh-generation Ford Mustang, to the new Chrysler 300C with its 6.4-liter Hemi V8, to electrified Jeeps and Chevys and more, come along with us as we recap the show and its highlights.
Send us your questions for the Mailbag and Spend My Money at: Podcast@Autoblog.com.
GREG MIGLIORE: Welcome back to "The Autoblog Podcast." I'm Greg Migliore. We have a great show for you today. We're going to break down the first Auto Show in the Motor City, the Detroit Auto Show, the North American International Auto Show. The first one since 2019.
With that, I'm going to bring in senior editor for all things consumer, Jeremy Korzeniewski and our news editor Joel Stockdale. How are you guys doing?
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Well, yesterday was a long day.
JOEL STOCKDALE: Indeed it was.
GREG MIGLIORE: Well said, guys. It's-- we're recording this at 9:15 the morning after. Jeremy, I think I saw you about 11 hours ago when we left the Mustang reveal.
So I would say this, I'm exhausted, but it feels pretty good. It feels like car-- like a real car show. This one was a bit different than it might have been historically, but I don't feel any less tired, let's put it that way.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: I think I remember telling you at that point when I looked at my watch that I had recorded over 19,000 steps in the day.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: So, yeah. That's a day in the life of the Auto Show.
GREG MIGLIORE: But you know what, it's also, in some ways, a dream job. We've got a lot to cover today. There's a new Mustang. The President showed up, as did almost-- it seemed like every elected official in Michigan cabinet members, Secretary Pete Buttigieg was there. So a lot happened at this year's show, more than we thought, frankly.
And plenty of cars to talk about. A number of press conferences, a number of things we're going to kind of run-down, including a V8 Chrysler. The 6.4 liter V8 is back under the hood of the 300. Some Jeep news, some Chevy news, Lincoln stuff, there's a refreshed Corsair. I guess we'll see if we have time for that one and some other things. But all in all, there definitely was, I would say, less overall news but still some pretty big touchstones.
So I think the easiest thing to do is, I mean, we got to talk about the President stopping by just real quick. I mean, that was-- I've never seen anything like that. I think it's the only time in my life I've been in the same building as the President. I don't think I actually saw him.
Jeremy, I think you did. You said you saw the back of his head, maybe. We think--
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, in one of the rare times they let us cross from our sequestered media area to where the show is actually taking place. There is a big group of people, and cameras pointed through the glass, and I was like, huh, what's that? And I looked, and there was the President and his entourage milling through the Ford booth. So, yeah, I mean, I saw them from 500 yards away, but he was definitely there, I can confirm.
GREG MIGLIORE: He was there. I tell you what, you know, we've covered a lot of like big things and like important executives cars, but I tell you what, I was standing at the front of the Convention Center, it's now called Huntington Place it used to be Cobo Hall and when the beast, the presidential limousine rolls up with flags flapping like on Jefferson. Like it just kind of went right through the circular part real quick. Got to admit, that's pretty cool.
That's as I believe our President said BFD about health care at one point. Yeah, I mean-- I got to admit, that was pretty cool to see. Security was wild. Definitely a life experience I will never forget.
We were-- I think I was talking to you, Joel, right outside of the press room, and I was typing a story. I stood up, and my Congresswoman was standing behind me. Like it was that kind of a show from a political stand-up perspective. So it was cool. I mean, there's actually going to be some more news today talking a lot about the charging infrastructure network. Yeah, it was pretty wild.
We'll get to cars like real quick. But any other just general show impressions? Jeremy, we'll start with you.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: It was-- it's just in general, it's good to be back at an Auto Show. I think we've talked ad nauseam about the fact that auto shows are getting-- they're kind of decreasing in invisibility these days as car companies realize that they can get a lot of press by holding their own separate events. But there's something special about being at an Auto Show with all the car companies there. You walk from booth to booth, you see all the latest vehicles and all the different shiny colors, you're surrounded by other like-minded people. It's a special kind of event and one that I'm glad we're still attending.
GREG MIGLIORE: How about you, Joel?
JOEL STOCKDALE: Yeah, this is one of the stranger auto shows that I've been to in a while. It's kind of up there with that first Chicago show kind of after mid-pandemic. Where the media day was still-- was on the day that they were still like setting up, everything and bringing in cars and opening up doors and didn't have air conditioning running. This time everything was pretty much set up but there were just kind of strange displays because there was this like dinosaur collaboration. So they're like giant models of dinosaurs all over the show hall and in a different area that was some sort of like off-road experience thing.
Outside the convention center is a 69-foot-tall inflated rubber ducky. And I mean, it's enormous. When I was heading home on the people mover to get back to my car, I come around the corner, and there is this building-sized duck next to the convention center. It was crazy.
And then you throw in a President into the mix and Secret Service agents everywhere and additional metal detectors to-- and wand waving searches and paths being closed down every which way that you can't go past even though you've got a job to do. It was a crazy, crazy show. And then, of course, the show floor itself was much more subdued compared with Detroit shows in the past. The displays were not quite as big and elaborate and whatnot.
But either way still nice to have in-person auto shows and to have a chance to see cars firsthand, to have a chance to talk with executives and engineers and designers because it's still one of the better opportunities to actually do all that stuff. But yeah it-- this was a very unusual Detroit Auto Show.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: You know, just an enthusiast. I just real quick point as an enthusiast, there's nothing there's no better opportunity than going to an Auto Show where vehicles are open. You can literally see them side-- you know, not side by side, but you can sit-in one, you can feel everything.
You can get an idea for the layout, and then you can go walk across the show floor to one of its competitors and do the exact same thing. Even for us people who drive these cars and get new vehicles all the time, there's really no better way to do comparisons than when they're all there under one roof. You really get a better idea for what you-- for how you feel about specific models versus their direct competitors.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah, I agree with that. I think the big difference between like Detroit of 2022 versus, say, even 2019 or 18 or 16 is there was not as much of an international presence. You know, Mercedes used to show up with their CEO, with their board members, and build a two-story stand with a full-service kitchen. Audi would do the same thing. I don't know if we'll ever see that return, and that was really when Detroit became this North American International Auto Show.
It really was the capital of auto shows, I would argue, in the world. I've been to Frankfurt, I've been to Tokyo, the Americans don't really show up for those shows, not like the international brands would show up for Detroit, let me put it that way to add some context. Maybe it doesn't have to be. Auto shows are a business.
You know, for the Auto Show in Detroit to continue to like, live on, maybe it just needs to be a good consumer show with some dinosaurs and some outdoor events. Some of the big three do press conferences, and maybe that's enough. I would argue they shouldn't let that-- I don't-- like I would argue they shouldn't just settle for that, though. I think, and I could be wrong, all of us love auto shows because they've been frankly pillars of our careers as automotive journalism. They really have been. I would argue that there's still opportunity for brands to reach consumers even through media activations.
The old days of like 15 pressers, yeah, you got lost in the shuffle, of course. But here's the other side of it, if we're going to talk about this, Chevy had three pretty cool things on their stand. The Colorado ZR2, the Equinox and the Blazer EV. For many of us, it was the first time we've seen these things in real life.
Kick it out a press release in the middle of a summer when half of the world is on a kayak sipping beer or ballgames or golf courses. It's probably not the way to do it. If you had done a press conference, we would have gotten-- we would have covered that more. They did do a press conference, but it wasn't as much of like a reveal if you will.
So I would argue for a show like Detroit if you can get maybe half a dozen, you know, and a little bit of a mix too. Get the Detroit 3 to show out, get a couple other brands in there, you've got a ballgame, you know. So I think there's a path forward. It's never going to be like it was in 1989 or 1999, but it's still going to probably be a pretty good consumer show. Play a little more into the branding exercise, I think.
I mean, the President showed up and called it the greatest show in the world. Yeah, that's a little bit of politics, but, I mean, you got-- you caught lightning in a bottle this year. You don't have to go like just become the Saint Louis Auto Show at this point if you don't want to. That's what I would say.
JOEL STOCKDALE: And there are a couple other things. I was a little bit frustrated because both Stellantis and General Motors had some big stuff that they had announced, like the week before or like two weeks before. GM with the Equinox EV and Stellantis with like the Jeep Recon and the Wagoneer S concepts. The Jeeps were actually not on display, at least while we were there. Not sure if that was a complication in getting those vehicles screened by Secret Service or something.
But it was a little bit disappointing not to see those being like the headliner for their press conferences and reveals and such, especially when it's like it's their hometown show. Now Ford definitely brought their kind of excitement and buzz around it with their outdoor activations and this big Mustang stampede thing. So I do appreciate that they were kind of pushing the show a little bit. But one of the other things, and I mean, I wish that they would have pushed it, not Ford, but GM and Stellantis would have push things a little bit more just because, like, this is the hometown show. This is like their chance to kind of make Detroit sort of shiny and glow and just generally exciting.
But the other thing is, especially with how much a lot of other automakers have kind of downplayed their Auto Show presence, I feel like there is an opportunity where you can kind of own a show by--
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JOEL STOCKDALE: --bringing something kind of special. And even if you didn't necessarily own a show, I do still feel like for a lot of people with an Auto Show coming up in the back of their minds, they're going to be thinking, oh, I want to keep an eye out for what comes out of this. This is kind of an opportunity for them to kind of-- this is-- it's sort of like a shared agreed-upon sort of date that like there will be car news that I may not have heard about and I want to tune in. That I don't know-- I guess it's kind of like even if you get a little bit lost in the shuffle, even if you had like a minor announcement somebody might see that they're like I came here to see like new Mustang and then like Oh, and I'm also going to see this because it's all being lumped into Auto Show news if that makes any kind of sense.
GREG MIGLIORE: No I agree. I think not everybody is going to be Tesla where you could do your like one-off event at like 9:00 West Coast time, and everybody's still going to watch it. You know, not everybody's going to be Ferrari, which could roll out an SUV the day before the Detroit Auto Show totally on their own schedule just because they want to. Even like with the Mustang, you know, like to me, that was taking advantage, like to your point, of a great opportunity like on the show.
I mean, there's a ton of value. There were a ton of media there too. Like that as many as a few years ago, but I mean, literally I was talking to people from all over the country who basically were like yeah, it's Detroit Auto Show, we figured we should show up. So some of the think about.
But I mean, it was-- I would say this, definitely one of the more memorable shows I've covered. We should definitely talk about some of the cars. That's got to lead off with the Ford Mustang. Jeremy, you and I were there until, like we just said, 11 hours ago.
It is an evolutionary take. Let's put it that way. There's still a manual transmission offered with the V8.
They're targeting 480 horsepower for the Ford Mustang GT version. And then the dark horse was a bit of a surprise. I don't know how many cliches and puns people can play with that. But an all-new sort of brand name, if you will, for the Mustang.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Mhm.
GREG MIGLIORE: I kind of like that. To start with the dark horse, there's so many like Shelby, Mach one Bullitt, you name it. They have a million names. And they're all awesome. I think they're all cool.
At different points, sometimes, we've sort of dissected. Like, well, is this thing really that much better than just, say like, a GT with a performance pack. And a lot of times, the answer's no. You're paying for the name.
But I like it. It's probably the last generation of the car as we know it. Dark Horse, that sounds cool. The car looked awesome. So that was kind of a fun surprise.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, it did come as a surprise. Well, I mean, sort of. We had inklings that--
GREG MIGLIORE: Right. Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: --there was-- yeah, that there's going to be something going on. I don't think-- I don't think we expected what we got, though. I personally didn't see-- like I knew that they were going to do something. They teased this new badge. They also kind of played a little bit of trick on the Mustang population by a couple of weeks ago, talking about their dark package and what should they name it, and everyone's like it should be Dark Horse. Like that's the obvious thing.
Like our own managing editor, Greg Raza, said, why not Dark Horse? That's the name right there. And they were like, Oh, night pony or, you know, they came up with all these other names.
And then the Detroit Auto Show rolls around, and they're like, Oh guess what, Dark Horse. Which, you know, like good on them. You know, like we say that we want to be surprised, we say that we want to like scramble at auto shows because something bigger than we expected happens, and we got it.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: And it's a cool package. Now I'll say they chose to do this event at night after the lights went down. It was somewhat lit, but there were huge LED screens everywhere, there were headlights everywhere, there were camera flashbulbs everywhere, it wasn't really the most conducive set up to display a dark package.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: You know, like seeing the details of it were pretty hard. And I even managed to get one of their little wristbands required to get down close to the car. And even as close as I could physically get to it, like making out the details, seeing the Dark Horse next to the GT and the other Mustang models, really we're going to see those in the light of day and get a feel for them. But it's actually a real performance package. They're saying it's going to be the-- more powerful than the standard GTs five-liter engine.
I think they accidentally let slip that 480-horse number. I don't think that they were actually ready to say that yet. It's definitely not finalized, but I think that's what they're expecting 480 horse out of the GT. And they said, what they say, at least 500 out of the Dark Horse. I noticed their target was--
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. I noticed the speakers sort of-- like the words kind of tumbled out of his mouth. He said like North of 480 or something like that.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah.
GREG MIGLIORE: You know how like when you like say a number but kind of stop halfway. Like, I think he almost said the number. I don't know what the number is. They probably don't-- they probably do know. And he just like kind of stopped and haltingly like end it up at 80 rather than saying 43 or 87.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah.
GREG MIGLIORE: So those are the ballpark figures. And, you know, that's pretty good. It's pretty aggressive.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: And it's a real performance package which--
GREG MIGLIORE: For sure.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: --is cool. I am in the camp that believes they don't really-- they've got so much, so many Mustangs, so many Mustangs. It's like-- it's practically Porsche 911 levels of variation at this point where you're like, oh which-- well, which one is this? Well, it's slightly below this one but slightly above that. They're segmenting that Mustang performance pretty, pretty tightly.
But, hey, this is their-- this is their last-- in all likelihood, last go-round with a traditional internal combustion Mustang front engine manual transmission rear wheel drive. So I mean, if you're going to go-- if you're going to go out with a bang, then go out with a bang.
GREG MIGLIORE: What do you think, Joel?
JOEL STOCKDALE: Yeah, I-- I've got mixed feelings across the board with this new Mustang. The Dark Horse does sound really cool, well, more than 500 horsepower handling upgrades and stuff. It kind of seems like it's sort of falls into that kind of Bullet Mark 1 kind of territory.
I think the paint color on it is really cool. You got a lot of metal flake. It's got kind of a pearl, very subtle color change kind of effect to it. The name is good on that.
There are things that I'm kind of disappointed at with the new Mustang. I am-- I've said a couple of times with you guys that I am very disappointed at the lack of a manual transmission on the four-cylinder. Ford has said that it was really low take rate for the manual EcoBoost Mustang. And I understand.
I also feel like it's not-- I don't know. I feel like it's maybe not great for Mustangs image to not necessarily have like an entry-level manual option.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. I agree.
JOEL STOCKDALE: And the other thing is, I guess I feel-- well, I mean, I wrote a whole editorial a while back about how the four-cylinder turbo versions of both Mustang and Camaro are kind of overlooked as like a nice entry point force for car enthusiasts. That they offer good power and torque for not a whole lot of money and rear-wheel drive, and a factory limited slip diff. All stuff that we got really excited about with a like BRZ and things, but I think get overlooked because everybody is like, oh, could I have V8?
And I know that we've said this before that like a lot of us do prefer the V8, but it's also kind of like, I mean, if you had the if you had the money and you had the choice between a Type R and an SI well, yeah, of course, you would go with the Type R, but if you don't have that kind of money I mean having something that's also sporty for less money and a manual is really nice. So I'm really disappointed to see that go away.
The styling I am-- I think I may come around to it over time. Like, I don't want to be completely locked in on my opinion of the design yet. It looks very much like the outgoing one. However, it is now pointier, and it's got more creases and edges.
I almost feel like it looks like sort of a low poly count version of the old Mustang. It has some angles it does look kind of cool and aggressive. Other angles, it just looks a little funny to me.
And the new interior is interesting. I'm not entirely sure I'm sold on it. It goes to the very in-vogue dual flat screens for instruments and infotainment. Which I don't know, I'm getting a little bit-- yeah, I'm getting a little bit tired of everybody doing that just plop a screen on the dashboard and call it a day. That being said, I did see that Ford is going to do some neat things with it. Like you can get a retro Fox body style analog gauge design to have on your screen. Which, you know, that's pretty neat, and that's kind of putting the screen to a little bit more fun use as opposed to just-- everybody does a screen now.
So yeah, you know, I just-- I just had kind of mixed feelings. I mean, I'm sure it's still going to be a lot of fun, though. The current Mustang is a lot of fun, this is a significantly updated version of the Mustang, so, you know, it should be fun.
GREG MIGLIORE: I like the Fox body. Like thing that you can do with the IP. I think that's kind of cool. I-- the interior is a very interesting, sort of, discussion point.
When I drove the Mach E, I thought its interior was more jarring compared to the almost retro standards of the current Mustang with its very cockpit sort of layout with the gauges right in front of you. I like that. When I'm driving a Mustang, I like that old-school feel. And I would be content to just have like a touchscreen for the infotainment, but it doesn't need to be all like wide screen like you're in the Cadillac LYRIQ or a Mercedes EQS or something.
It's not quite what they're doing here, but it is a very prominent screen now in the car. That's the way the world right now. I can make my peace with that. I think, in some ways, maybe Ford might have known that.
They knew they had a very retro interior that a lot of people liked, myself included. So maybe that's part of it is, hey, well, this is the present, this is the future, but we can make it look like inside of a Fox body. So, you know, I don't know. I guess they had to do that. But like usual, I'm a little-- I have mixed emotions on that.
As far as the styling goes, I tend to like it. This is straight out of the Mustang playbook, which is make the car look pointier every few years and sharper. When they went retro back in 05, you know, it was a fairly-- it was a very mid-2000 look. Similar, almost like with the uncomplicated designs we saw on some of the other muscle cars like the Charger, and the mainly the Charger at that time. A little bit with the challenger too.
But, you know, it just it kept getting sharper and more like kind of buffer, and now this is sort of the culmination of that. I tend to like it, to be honest. Initial impressions are I like that design, and there's some pretty cool features here.
You know, they-- this remote rev thing. I don't know. I'm not necessarily sure why you would need to do that, but it's kind of neat. You know, that's kind of cool.
And then the handbrake feature. They're really steering into drifting, pardon the pun here, but that's pretty cool. If you're into like either drifting or just going into empty parking lots or empty snow-covered parking lots, you can certainly have some fun with the new Mustang. We'll see. This is it, though. You know, this is sort of the last run of the Mustang.
I got to believe every special edition they can think of they're going to start to roll out in the coming years. And it'll probably have a pretty long run. My guess is they're going to let this thing run till they stop selling internal combustion cars.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: I have a few bits, and I'll try to do this quickly. I don't like remote rev. I think it's an absolutely terrible, terrible idea. It's one thing to have like a person driving their car and revving it up at every red light or sitting in a parking lot and revving the engine and showing off or rev and down main street and kind of irritating everyone who's trying to sit-in a little cafe Bistro down the street of their little small town Americana. That's one thing. That's kind of expected.
Do we really need people with the remote ability to be far away and have this unattended car revving up and irritating everybody? I can't think of any good reason other than to irritate people. Why people are going to be like, you know what, I want that. You know, like you're going to do it once or twice because it's cool, and you're going to say, hey, look, my car can do but then what's the point of it?
To park it somewhere and just rev the engine from remote, and people are going to be like, who is doing that? It's kind of like that Tesla sound system thing where you can make the car make speakers. Anyway, I don't I get the point of that. As far as the styling goes, it's like very 1971 Mustang to me. You know, the 69-70 kind of were a little bit more blunt but very aggressive, and I think that's how I picture the current one that we see.
And then in 71, they elongated the nose, they made it look a lot more aggressive, and that's what I see out of this. I see a longer nose, I see a low sill. It really looks like they were-- I don't know if they would say this or not, but it looks like they're kind of inspired by that switch from 1970 to 71 here. The overall style I like. The detailing, I think, is too busy.
The grill has got all kinds of angles and shapes, and you know, I don't-- I tend to prefer clean designs over busy designs. So to me, it's a little overdone, but I don't dislike it. I don't see it, and I'm like, ewe. That's not an attractive car.
It's cool. I like it, and I get it. But I wish they kind of showed a little bit more restraint in the design.
As far as the interior goes, I would have liked it a lot more if it showed some retro touches. This is a Mustang after all. The fact that they had thousands of people show up for this Mustang reveal is because people love the past Mustangs. And I think there's a-- like nameplates like that have a unique opportunity to be fully modern with a few hints to the past.
And I would have loved to see like, I don't know, like maybe some engine turning-- turned aluminum in the interior or something. Some little cues here and there to remind you, yeah, this is a modern car. It's got a digital cluster big infotainment system, but we also realize it's a Mustang with a huge history, so play into that a little bit. I think that's a lost opportunity.
I also don't care about the loss of the six-speed manual in the EcoBoost. I think Joel is absolutely right in his argument. I personally don't care because I would never buy an EcoBoost Mustang. I would absolutely buy a V8 with the manual transmission. Otherwise, I probably would choose something else. That's just me, personally.
So that doesn't really bother me. Do I wish they still offered it? Sure. Just to give people the choice.
But you know, people voted with their wallets. I fully believe that that Ford was not seeing a great demand for that, and so they chose not to offer it anymore. I think the fact that they're offering the traditional manual transmission with the V8 speaks volumes as to what they realize that people actually want to buy, and that's a muscle car. They want a Ford Mustang with the muscular engine, the traditional transmission rear-wheel drive.
That's-- that to me, that's what a Mustang is. And if I wanted a sports car, I probably would choose to buy a sports car instead but-- just my two cents on the Mustang overall. I'm actually really looking forward to driving one and seeing them on the streets.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. Sounds good. It's-- every time a car like the Mustang shows up at an Auto Show, it tends to be showstopping event. You know, it was, I think, probably by far the biggest deal of the show. It really, you know, at least from the sheet metal perspective, I think it definitely was quite the event. I've been to some Mustang reveals before, and this rate's up there.
So in some ways, you've got to give some kudos to Ford for saying, hey, we're going to hold a press conference. Technically, it was off-site, but we're not going to get into semantics here. I mean, it was a big show, bit event. I thought it was cool that Jim Farley and Bill Ford were kind of at the front gates, sort of like just mingling with enthusiasts shaking hands. That was cool. And it was, honestly-- I thought it was really cool to walk down Jefferson and see like every Mustang you could ever have imagined was there. I mean, even some really deep cuts, so I thought that was cool.
All right. So check out our site. We have a bunch of stories where we break down the rev-- the auto rev feature, which Jeremy does not like, just to be clear. We break down the interior.
The Dark Horse is there. Full first look at the car and probably some more coverage by the time this podcast drops. So definitely head over to the site.
And let's shift gears over to the rest of the show and things surrounding the show. Talk about Jeep. They had a press conference. It was, basically, the first one of the day.
This was a weird one because they had a lot of things they could show, like the Recon. That's super cool, really wanted to see that. Don't know if that one didn't get cleared by Secret Service or what the deal was with that, but it wasn't part of the event. They did do, I thought, a pretty nice well-done press conference about the 30th anniversary Grand Cherokee. They recalled how I think it was Lee Iacocca and the mayor of Detroit at the time Coleman Young drove through a plate glass window at Cobo Hall shattered it, and that was the debut.
So they did a nice job kind of calling back to that, which, again, was very cool, but it's just a 30th-anniversary car. There's nothing really important there. So to me, Jeep didn't exactly play all their cards even though it was a pretty nice press conference and kind of interesting. 30th anniversary Grand Cherokee looks pretty good. It's a 4xe.
It's definitely-- I think-- here's my hot take. The Grand Cherokee has gotten a little too bland. It doesn't quite have the demonstrative curves and silhouette that the last couple of generations did. This, I think, with some of the extra like body treatments, cleans it up, and it looks a little more like itself.
You know, I was talking to somebody about the Grand Cherokee, and I was like, hey, what do you think about that? That seems like a car you would like. They were like, that just looks like another GMC Acadia. And I was like, you know what, you're not wrong from a distance.
So long story short, this special edition looked OK. It was nice press conference, but I guess I wanted to see the Recon and a few other things too. So I mean, Joel, what do you think?
JOEL STOCKDALE: Yeah, I-- the 30th-anniversary edition is fine. I-- to be honest, I think it would have been kind of neat if they'd done like kind of a whole bunch of gray cladding along the bottom like the original Grand Cherokee. And in reference to that original reveal back in 1992. In our post, we've embedded a clip from that reveal. You can see them.
There driving it literally up the steps up toward Cobo Hall, and they do just drive it straight through this big plate glass window on the way to driving it onto the show floor. These are the kinds of stunts that, while kind of corny, are also kind of fun about auto shows that I kind of miss. But I digress.
As for the 30th-anniversary edition, it's fine. It's what you kind of expect from an anniversary edition. It's a paint and trim package. It includes some things. It's--
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JOEL STOCKDALE: --not super exciting. It's nice since it's the 4xe. To be honest, I actually think that the current Grand Cherokee in, like the short wheelbase version is actually pretty handsome, and I like the slightly sportier back end on it than the longer Grand Cherokee L.
Also, Jeep announced a Willys edition of the Wrangler 4xe--
GREG MIGLIORE: That was cool.
JOEL STOCKDALE: --which is ever so slightly cheaper than the Sahara 4xe. And I mean slightly. It's like $600 or $700 cheaper than the Sahara. So slightly cheaper 4xe is nice.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JOEL STOCKDALE: Wish it would be a bigger price difference but because it's still well over $50,000 to get one. But it's also kind of nice to see that you can get a 4xe that's slightly more off-roady than like the Sahara but not as hardcore as the Rubicon. Because the Willys comes with like mud train tires and the limited slip diff and things included as standard. It's also got the release decals and the black grill.
I also really like that it's got the-- it's got the retro four-wheel drive sticker that you can get on other Willys wranglers and gladiators, but they ad lib a little bit of script on the top of it that says electric four-wheel drive, which is kind of a nice little touch. Yeah, so that was kind of the other thing that they announced at Detroit. I also was very disappointed not to be able to see the Recon and the Wagoneer S in person. Because those are big buzz items. Like I-- that's a big deal. I want to see the not electric successor to Wrangler but kind of the more refined electric companion to Wrangler.
GREG MIGLIORE: I got to correct what I just said. It wasn't Lee Iacocca. You guys probably know who it was, though. Who do you think would have driven up the steps of Cobo in 1992 Chrysler?
JOEL STOCKDALE: I mean, I think I actually know.
GREG MIGLIORE: Bob Lutz.
JOEL STOCKDALE: Yep.
GREG MIGLIORE: I mean, of course, who was going to drive up the stunt? He's probably-- maybe wasn't even a stunt. Bob Lutz was just like, hey, this is how I'm getting here. I'm late. Up the steps we go. Who knows.
Still going strong at 90, though. So, you know, Bob Lutz. That's awesome. Yeah.
Real quick, Jeremy, you were there. We were on the other side of the Presser. I was over where like, the cars were flying up and down the like kind of off-road course. You know what did you think?
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, I was front and center at this one. I love Jeep. I've always been a Jeep guy.
This is disappointing to me overall. I mean not, not the actual vehicles. I think the Grand Cherokee 30th anniversary is, is totally fine. I think that that should be something that they build and show off at the Detroit Auto Show.
The 4xe the Wrangler. I love the Wrangler 4xe. This is a very slightly less expensive version of it, but it's almost not. I mean they called it the new entry point for the Wrangler, but I don't think that's really the point, I think it's another alternative to 4xe potential buyers.
I think Joel hit the nail on the head. It straddles the line. It still gives-- it gives you some extra off-road bits and pieces that you know, but you don't have to step all the way up to a Rubicon, but it's barely any cheaper than the Sahara. So I don't think of it really as, like, oh, the new entry-level or the entry point I just think of it as another one to choose from for buyers. And the fact that those are the two things that they showed off, they're trim levels and packages great. I think they should exist and I think that they should bring them to the show and we should write about them.
But this isn't the news that we're looking for. Like to Joel's point, they did something. We'll talk about General Motors a little bit more. They like they had a little bit more pomp and circumstances than-- pomp and circumstance than GM did at the show but not enough. You know, if there was some sort of legitimate reason why they couldn't at least show a concept version of the Wagoneer S or Recon, you to really build on the momentum because these are two vehicles.
And I talked to some executives at Stellantis about this. These are two vehicles that people are really excited about. They are additions to the Jeep range. They're not like replacing models, they're adding models and really exciting ones. And they issued press releases before the Detroit Auto Show, and then we get to the Detroit Auto Show and nary a peep no sign of them, which is disappointing to Joel's point and you too, Greg, I think you mentioned this.
If there was some sort of legitimate reason why they couldn't bring them out due to the president's visit or something like that, that's not their fault. If not, then what a letdown. If that's not the case, a completely preventable letdown. So that was disappointing. But no shade on the actual vehicles themselves.
I have no issues with the 30th anniversary Grand Cherokee. It's a nice car. It's a nice package. I think it's too expensive.
And the Willys 4xe also cool. I think it's great. I think it's a nice package. I'm glad that they're offering it, and I'm glad they showed it. I think what they really need to do is make the 4xe optional on all Wrangler trims and let people actually just go in instead of doing this slow roll. They, in their press release or in their press conference, they said it's America's best-selling plug-in hybrid.
Well, you could really be America's best-selling plug-in hybrid if you would just extend that powertrain to the rest of the range. And it's not like Stellantis is building, you know-- it's not like they've got to divvy up their batteries amongst a dozen different vehicles, they barely build any vehicles with battery-- with big battery packs, this is like one of their only ones.
Like if they couldn't get their ducks in a row to be able to build 100,000 of them, 50-- let's say 50,000 of them in a year. I mean, come on, guys. Like if that's the case, then get with the times. They need to offer that on all Wrangler trims and let people make the choice of getting the efficient electrified powertrain without having to spend huge amounts of money on packages that they may not want or need. So my two cents I really like the vehicles, but I wish there was more.
GREG MIGLIORE: All right. One press conference that I actually think lived up to the hype, and the car lived up to the hype. It was very honest. It was the Chrysler 30oc. That's right, the 300c is back.
Presser, this was the night before the show. They held it at the spirit of Detroit Plaza, which is that statue for those of you from the area you might know. It's kind of by the river at the foot of Jefferson.
It was good they had a nice tent. It was-- the temperature was perfect. They pulled the cover off the car. It's a 300 with a 6.4 liter Hemi V8. This is, essentially, like a 300 Scat Pack, which is great to me. Kind of a brief history of the 300 and the V8.
You know, originally, the 300c, of course, was the V8 car. They dropped the C designation a couple model years ago. You could still get the 5.7 liter Hemi V8 on the S model, but it wasn't exactly a full C. Now the C is back with the 6.4 liter, which I think is great. That's the 392.
We kind of thought this might happen given what they did with some of the charger like outgoing models, and I really think it was the right move. You know, there's some basic things like the wheels, a little bit interior stuff, some badges, but I mean, for all intents and purposes, it's like the 300c like it never went away with the big V8, which actually that's my favorite Hemi. If you're going to ask me which one I would sign up, for it's that one.
So again, Ralph Giles, head of design for the whole company, showed up, gave remarks. To me, that was-- like that did live up to the hype. I mean, I will say it's just a V8 in a car that's not going to be sold for much longer. It is what it is. It wasn't like they rolled out a new electric concept. They did hint at that, though.
Like as the press conference is winding down, they even mentioned like so this is about the end of the road for the 300. In that sense, I was a little surprised how like almost nostalgic. It was poignant to even, but then they showed a picture of the airflow concept on screen. So I mean, I think we know what they're going to do next. And it's a really good press conference. That they really like wove it into like the cars history in Detroit going back to the 50s, the original 1955 300c.
The car is built just across the river in Brampton, Ontario, I think is the plant. That was the rear-wheel drive factory where a lot of the worthy LX cars were built. So I mean, again, you know you talk about stagecraft with like the Mustang, this to me was probably the second best press conference of the show. And Ralph did a really good job of weaving just how much the LX cars-- the 300, the 300 was, I believe, the first one too back in 2005 or one of them that just brought back the notion of rear wheel drive performance with a V8 engine.
So, you know, I don't really have a complaint here. It lived up to the hype. I think Chevy, which we could get to shortly here, did put a big V8 in the Tahoe.
Cool car. Cool SUV. It's like a performance RST thing, but you know that was one that didn't really have the hype. I think in some of this was like literally, the Tahoe is the Tahoe, whatever V8 happens to be in it at any given moment. This presser in this car did a really good job of showing off like this is like an all-timer. To me, like if we were going to do like a Hall of Fame of cars, of the century, I think you got to put the 300 in it.
In its most recent state, clearly diminished, clearly sales dropped. It just-- it never was able to continue with the panache of like the Dodge muscle cars. It just sort of lost a little bit of its audience. But I mean to me, I looked out there, and you saw the like all of the car of the year awards of this thing won. How it really was on like, you know, like the cutting edge back 15, 16, 17 years ago, and they really captured that. I mean, I can't wait to drive a 300. I hope they put a 300c of the press fleet. So yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: I've heard rumors that they've already taken all the reservations for all 2000 of them.
GREG MIGLIORE: I don't doubt it.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: I don't know if that's true or not, but that's what the automotive rumor mill is thinking. I don't have a whole lot to say about it that you didn't say, Greg. I think they had all the parts to make this car handy. And so, you know, it was a no-brainer and a really good send-off for the 300.
I also agree with you about this is the Hemi that I would want. I mean, I think the Hellcat's great for going to drag strips and scaring the crap out of your family members and stuff like that but as far as actual daily driving, the naturally aspirated 392 is the one that I prefer. And yeah, good send-off for the 300. And I really hope that Chrysler's got some fun things up its sleeves to show us after the 300 is gone.
GREG MIGLIORE: All right. Chevy has been something we've kind of been dancing around the edges with here throughout this morning. Kind of a weird presser. Yeah, like the Tahoe gets a bigger V8. They mentioned their strategy, and they have the Equinox EV there and the Blazer EV. And actually, I think this is probably the first time most people actually saw the Silverado EV.
So, just again, is a list there of as a reader, you probably don't care what the press conference was like. In that sense, it was a little underwhelming. But the stuff we did see was like high fiber, high protein, good stuff. I think they could have played it up a little bit more.
It's kind of fun how many final edition V8s we're getting here or limited edition V8s we're getting as EVs are coming out. But I was really impressed to see the Blazer EV in person. I thought that looked great.
The Equinox, with its targeted $30,000 price range pretty good. I don't think it's quite as like sexy as the Blazer, but it's still pretty good-looking. Could be a very good electric family hauler. So I mean, that was kind of my high-level take away. Like not a lot of sizzle but a fair amount of steak just sitting out on the buffet.
JOEL STOCKDALE: And so with the Tahoe RST performance edition, it's kind of a neat package. It takes the regular 6.2 liter RST and upgrades the intake and exhaust, so now it makes 433 horsepower. It also gets all of the Tahoe police pursuit vehicle all its suspension goodies. So it sits a little bit lower, it's got a thicker anti-roll bar, stiffer springs, things like that. And it's also got bigger brakes. So it's a comprehensive performance package for the Tahoe, and I think that's neat.
But it's also very much like the Jeep stuff that we're talking about. But it's like it's not the headliner that you would have kind of hoped for and expected. And, again, Chevy showed kind of its bigger announcement like last week or a couple of weeks ago, with the Equinox EV being kind of their mainstream entry-level affordable electric crossover, which is a big deal.
It's a vehicle that's kind of a size that most Americans like and purchase. It's full electric, and it's starting at around $30,000 before any kind of like tax credits or anything. That's a big deal, and frankly, I think it's actually a very attractive-looking car. They had it in probably about my favorite configuration in like this bright blue metallic with a white roof.
And, you know, I just feel like the Equinox should have been like just save it for the show, make a big splash with that. Maybe do maybe do Tahoe RST like a couple of weeks ago, instead. But it was nice to actually see that on the floor and to have that alongside with like the Blazer EV, which in pictures I think is a bit polarizing, but I think in person it works a whole lot better. You get a better feel for it's kind of long and low proportions.
I think Chevy may-- I think GM may have had a slightly better kind of on-floor presence with sort of showing off all this stuff that's coming very soon. I guess I wouldn't discount Mopar entirely. They did have the Charger Daytona electric concept that they showed back at Woodward dream cruise on the floor. But at this point, that's slightly old.
I mean, I'm sure that there would be people complaining about, like, oh, what do you mean you are discounting that? It's like, well, we are in the-- we are in the news business. So the charter Daytona, we've known about that for like a month now. Equinox and Recon and things like that those are much fresher newer things. Boy, this is all sounding kind of ridiculous to me, as I said out loud, and maybe it is a little bit, but it's also the business that we're in.
Anyway, I digress. I do think the Chevy electric presence was good. And you factor in having Silverado EV there too. I think they had a clear presentation of like we're serious about electric, look at all this stuff that we're doing. And I think that's important and I think it's exciting.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. No, I agree. It's funny you mentioned. It we'll totally play inside baseball here for a minute.
The Daytona SRT Banshee concept that's another one that would have probably gone head to head with the Mustang for Best in Show, but they reveal that it speed nights like a month ago. So to your point, yeah, it's been out for six weeks. Were in the news business, you know. I thought it was cool to see it. I did took some pictures of it but--
And that's where, again, though-- that's where auto shows do have a value. And maybe it decreases from a media perspective, but you know consumers probably didn't get to see the Daytona concept up close, but this week they probably can at the Auto Show. So I think that's where there is some intrinsic value. It's funny, though, when people talk about like how every brand wants to do these one-off things.
You know, if you did them all at auto shows, side note here, you don't have to pay for like flying everybody in and staging these events. Not that auto shows are cheap, but something to think about. You do one press conference as opposed to like this, like three-day event that Dodge did. Dodge would probably say, hey, this is what we want to do, more power to them, more electric power. But it's an observation about the future of auto shows, I guess. So that was Chevy.
Let's move along to Lincoln, which was pretty quiet as well. Although it did get a lot of attention from the elected officials. Jeremy, you saw Biden over there. I saw, when I was sort of had my face up against the glass too, I saw a number of like the parties kind of rolling through the Lincoln stand too. They had the L 100 concept, which looks cool.
And that-- I mean then there was also like a very-- like a refresh of the Corsair which, OK. All right. That's one that could be a press release in August if you will. But to their credit, they did a press conference and had actually a pretty nice traditional stand too.
Like if you go to the Lincoln stand, you will feel like you're at the Detroit Auto Show in any year. They had their like covered part with the like the drapes. Like it looked legit with a coffee bar. So yeah, I guess we can do Lincoln and then just other things that maybe stood out. But we'll lead off with Lincoln.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: I went and took a look at it. You know, the Corsair is Lincoln's best-selling car or best-selling vehicle, so it's an important one for them. I don't have a whole lot to say about the refreshed Corsair. It still looks like a Corsair. I think Lincoln's crossovers and SUVs look good in general, inside and out. I don't have negative bad things to say about them.
They got rid of the kind of hot rod 2.3 liter engine in the Corsair, so now it's just the standard two liter 250 horse that you see across Ford's portfolio and also the Grand Touring with the plug-in hybrid, which is more to 266 horsepower or something like that plus some electric range. That's obviously the one to buy, I would think, if you are shopping for one. And it's a nice vehicle, and I like their new color too. I don't remember exact-- whisper blue is what it's called. It just came to me.
(MURMURING) It's whishper blue. I don't know why they called it that. It's a cool color, though.
Lincoln's other concepts. This is the first time I personally saw them. They've had a line of concepts now, and I don't remember all of their names off the top of my head, but they're all really far out there. They don't look like anything approaching a production vehicle. I don't have a problem with that.
They want to show off cool concepts, or designers want to stretch their muscles and say, like, hey, this is like a vision for Lincoln moving forward, and if a few of those things, a few of the bits and pieces from them are incorporated into future design language then great. But I think to Greg's point, you walk through the Detroit Auto Show, you're not going to be disappointed when you stumble on Lincoln. It might not have been the reason you went, but you'll find plenty cool things to see while you're there.
GREG MIGLIORE: All right.
JOEL STOCKDALE: Yeah, the Corsair, just to echo Jeremy's, it's a very facelift facelift. It is a light refresh, but also, that's fine because the Corsair is a pretty nice little kind of entry-level luxury crossover. And that's a little bit sad to see the high-end 2.3 liter engine go away, but it looks like it's got a way better touch screen infotainment system. It looks much more premium and is much bigger.
And, you know, they didn't, they didn't mess up any of the nice interior stuff and exterior design stuff that we already really liked. So that's good. And, yeah, like it had two of their concepts that they've shown earlier. The-- I'd say the showstopper is the L 100 concept that they showed at Pebble. It's just long and low, and it's got like the world's biggest like suicide doors that open up and like a canopy, and it's-- the thing is just insane when you see it in person.
And that, along with like their star concept SUV. And the fact that their whole display has all of the bells and whistles that you expect from like a Detroit Auto Show display. It's got the cool, like brass curtain thing that they've had at other big Auto Show displays. And it just-- it feels like the full-fat kind of display.
And actually, I was kind of surprised to see Buick actually had a very good-looking display too with like kind of soft modern futuristic kind of display panels and turntables. And on top of that display table is the gorgeous Wildcat EV concept that was shown a few months ago, which I still-- I wish I could think of a way to justify them putting it into production outside of like doing a crazy ultra limited the production run of it because it's a gorgeous, gorgeous car. But yeah, it's kind of funny that like of the displays of the show that really felt auto showy and like kind of a celebration of what's current and what's to come and what's exciting about cars, were Lincoln and Buick. Which is a little weird to say. But it was nice to see at least a little bit of that kind of going that extra mile for one of the big shows as opposed to sort of the bare minimum displays that are shipped out to the regional shows all across the country.
GREG MIGLIORE: I kind of wondered if maybe just Buick and Lincoln tend to be smaller footprints. Maybe that's like all they had. So they're like, why not, we got to go with like the tuxedo if you will. This is our Auto Show footprint, or at least the one for Detroit. To your point there, Joel, the Buick stand looked way better than the Cadillac one, which was right next to it.
So I thought-- I mean, Cadillac used to have like a building inside Cobo with a staircase that recalled the architectural landmark staircase that is at the General Motors Design Center. That's how like bespoke Cadillac used to be. Complete with upstairs rooms, whatever you wanted. So I love the Wildcat, though.
I think the name is great. I don't know. That could be an interesting move for Buick. I mean, it could be something sort of like the Celestiq is for Cadillac.
I get Cadillac Buick probably don't want to get too much into the coachbuilding business here of these low-volume electric things, but yeah, I don't know. I'm with you. That was the first time I've seen it in person, yet another plug for auto shows, and it looked awesome. It looked great.
JOEL STOCKDALE: And you also mentioned something else that was kind of a strange absence, and that was the Cadillac Celestiq. That wasn't anywhere to be seen. And that is a technically is a concept at the moment, but it's coming to production. And that was nowhere to be seen at the Cadillac booth, which is really bizarre.
Especially when like Lincoln had these two concepts that were like really far out and like very much like one-off custom stuff, not like something that's actually going to be in production. It was just weird not to see Celestiq from Cadillac. I mean, they had Lyric, which was nice but like, well, that's slightly old news at this point. It's still good to see it but--
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JOEL STOCKDALE: --it's like where's Cadillac's like big showstopper.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. John's Jerry driven the Lyric.
JOEL STOCKDALE: I mean, LA is still a couple of months away.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JOEL STOCKDALE: New York is even farther away. I'm sure we'll see them, and I'm sure we'll see it, especially at New York, for sure. But it's like, you know, Cadillac, you could stand out a little bit more too. Especially because you're kind of like the Premier luxury brand, and you're leading the charge for GM's electric luxury.
GREG MIGLIORE: Especially too because Cadillac tends to be like very-- like every now and then Detroit centric except when they're like subleasing in New York, which they did for a bit for the headquarters. But they also do try to be play up the Detroit angle sometimes. So I mean--
JOEL STOCKDALE: Well, and then Celeste is going to be built in Warren--
GREG MIGLIORE: Right.
JOEL STOCKDALE: --the Detroit suburbs. So it's like, why not?
GREG MIGLIORE: All right. So I think we've hit the show floor pretty hard. Any other observations about just things that you guys saw that stood out? Running through the press conference list, I think we hit just about everything that was there. Anything that wasn't even on a press conference list you just saw. There was a DeLorean that was pretty cool.
A lot of dinosaurs. That's-- like, if your kids are into dinos, they're running about one part towards the center back of the show. I think that's-- yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: A whole bunch of flying car things.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. Flying car things.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: There were a lot of-- I mean, you guys can't see us, but Joel just rolled his eyes.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: For good reason. We've been talking about flying cars for forever. But like if you want to see some of these electric vertical takeoff and landing like basically like human-sized drones, if you want to see it in person, this is your opportunity to see them in person.
Do I think that they're coming anytime soon that you're going to buy and fly around in or even in the next five years? Do I think you're going to be taking rides in through city centers? No, I don't.
Maybe 20 years. I don't know. We'll see. But if you want to see them there, they're.
GREG MIGLIORE: All right. Sounds good. Any final thoughts there, Joel, on the day and the show that was.
JOEL STOCKDALE: Yeah. I think we've covered it all quite well. I guess the one little thing that I will mention there's a variety of other kind of like custom cars and luxury cars that some other groups have brought. And I was actually kind of excited to see actually slightly disappointed that it wasn't featured more prominently since it is developed in part with General Motors. But Lingenfelter had their electric converted Chevy El Camino--
GREG MIGLIORE: Saw that. That was cool
JOEL STOCKDALE: --in the corner somewhere, and that's going-- and that's been built using kind of the prototype for the GM electric connected cruise system. They're kind of relatively turnkey electric conversion kit that's coming up that both GM and Lingenfelter are developing. But is glad to see that.
I'm really excited to hear more. If anybody from GM is listening, let me know. I'm excited about that stuff. But, yeah, so there's still interesting things to see even if the show is a little less robust than past years.
GREG MIGLIORE: It will be interesting. We'll kind of close this out. Final thought here. This Paris Motor Show is an October.
Traditionally that got a lot of hype mainly because it was in Paris. The domestics didn't necessarily show out there, but it was a very strong European show. It will be interesting to see how the rest of the Auto Show calendar plays out.
LA is right behind it in November, I think, and then we have CES which has attracted some pretty spotlight reveals. It's another sort of interesting show where some years car companies care about it, some years they don't. So-- and then Chicago and away we go again. New York in the spring. So we'll-- it will be very interesting to see in the next year how they evolve. Whether it's not just from a consumer standpoint but from like in our business, how do the car companies interact with these shows?
So that was quite the show. This has been quite the podcast. It's been good to see you guys.
Let's take some vitamins, drink some water, get some caffeine going through your veins. Send us your Spend My Monies. We'll get back to those the coming weeks. That's firstname.lastname@example.org. If you enjoyed the show, five stars, the Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts. Be safe out there, and we'll see you next week.